I have a question about how people here view roster/lineup strategy. The question is probably relevant for WIS baseball, but in this case my situation regards an OOTP team I have put together playing solitaire, which is the only way I play OOTP Baseball.

It is 1963, my team won 85 games to come in third in the NL in 1962.

My outfielders are Felipe Alou, Hector Lopez and Frank Thomas - all RH, and Al Spangler, Lee Maye, Ty Cline and Wes Covington - all LH.

Only Alou really has full-time PA/AB for the season, which can matter for fatigue in this game, like in WIS, and for injuries, which can last for a long time during the season in OOTP.

I am leaning toward platooning, so it would be:

Against RH pitchers: LF Covington, CF Maye, RF Alou.

Against LH pitchers: LF Thomas, CF Alou and RF Lopez.

But doing so means my pinch-hitters against RH pitchers would have to be Spangler, Cline, Thomas and Lopez, not necessarily in that order, so no LH power off the bench, and against LH pitchers, would be Covington, Maye, Spangler, Cline. Cline is the defensive substitute in CF, Maye the defensive sub in LF.

So the question is: should I NOT platoon so as to have a LH/RH hitter - hopefully one better than Spangler or Cline - on the bench for late-inning power hitting, or go with a platoon. What is the best use of players in this case with 400 circa PA?

And another option - should I see if I can trade Spangler, who is more of a classic number 1 or 2 hitter more than most of the others above except for Maye, and see if I can get a LH or RH or SH with some power? I would probably have to include at least a second player. Or maybe try to trade Cline, who might have more value.

The lineup, in case it helps to figure this out, is likely as follows for the 1963 season, if I go platoon:

Vs. RH pitchers:

Ron Hunt 2B
Lee Maye CF
Felipe Alou RF
Willie McCovey 1B
Wes Covington LF
Ed Charles 3B
Johnny Roseboro C
Bobby Wine SS
pitcher

Vs. LH Pitchers:

Ron Hunt 2B
Ed Charles 3B
Felipe Alou CF
Willie McCovey 1B
Hector Lopez RF
Frank Thomas LF
Johnny Roseboro C
Bobby Wine SS
pitcher

The backup catcher is Hank Foiles, the backup Infielders are Charlie Neal and Alex Grammas just to complete the picture.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts and advice. I don't like not having a decent hitter off the bench, ideally one that has a lefty-righty advantage. But then it seems like a waste of a Hector Lopez or a Wes Covington or Lee Maye or Frank Thomas to keep them on the bench instead of hitting against the pitchers versus whom they would do best on a regular basis.

I usually draft myself, but this time, starting the league in 1962, I decided to give myself more of a challenge by letting the AI draft my team for the inaugural draft. I tinkered around the edges, trading for Ed Charles to play third for example, but mostly letting it go.

After the 1962 season the big acqusition in the rookie draft was Ron Hunt, giving me a solid leadoff hitter with good OBP, and a good 2B just when Neal was fading out of being useful.

In case your curious, the rotation is Jim Perry, Lew Burdette, Pedro Ramos, Al Jackson and Curt Simmons, with Mick McCormick and a rookie Denny McClain as emergency starters.

Italyprof - good to see you.

Without knowing anything about how the platoon calculation works in OOTP, nor how fatigue works, it is impossible for me to opine on what would be optimal in the situation you described.

In WIS, my general thought process is:
-- Unless I'm in a league that requires it (because of theme rules) or necessitates it (like in a progressive, where you have limited control over your roster), I don't like platooning as a strategy. In most leagues it's difficult to know how many innings you're going to be facing a LHP or RHP. So to ensure you have the platoon advantage at all times, you need to (a) buy more PA than you will use in the season or (b) be willing to play one half of the platoon fatigued if necessary. But the fatigue penalty erodes - and eventually wipes out - the platoon advantage. So I don't like it as a strategy.
-- The platoon advantage in WIS is not negligible, but it's not massive either. If any of the hitters are clearly superior to the others, I would play them all the time, regardless of pitcher.
-- Having a good PH on the bench is nice, but I would never bench a superior hitter just on the off chance that I might need to get a platoon advantage at some point in the game.

So, if OOTP is anything like WIS, I guess my guidance would be:
-- Play the best hitters as much as you can, regardless of platoon advantage
-- If 2 guys are comparable overall, sure, platoon them.
-- Don't worry about the bench.

Thank you contrarian23, and great to see you here too.

There is a lot of debate in the OOTP forums about how fatigue works, but it's clear that it exists, and overuse of a player based in some way on their real life PA or IP is central to that. You can also set fatigue for position players to be higher or lower, and I usually det it high so that the roster matters. You can set pitcher stamina likewise, I usually det it at medium.

You raise a great point, that platooning virtually guarantees having more PA than you need and so wasting some, while having good players on the bench means not having them on the field.

But these are uunavoidable problems, especially if you inherit say, at least two outfielders with 350 or 400 PA. Your options are:

1. Get two more players of opposing hand advantage to platoon them with, though the fewer good PA this entails the less costly a trade for them will be, so hopefully your wasting g the fewest good PA possible.

2. Bench them and trade more valuable players for fuall-time players to replace them st those two (in this case OF) positions.

3. Trade them to try to get such full-time players, but with part-timers , you would need to add other pieces to make another team interested.

4. Trade for other players based on quality, not worrying about LH-RH advantage.

The criteria is which approach costs the least in terms of quality.

Another thing I have done and observed others doing to combat the excessive platoon is to play games with their Tandem pitching settings.

For example, start an average (bullpen) LH pitcher for 25-35 pitches and 3/4 to pull him for a RH stud tandem. That usually gets the heavy platooners to start a RH hitter, but then when the pitching change happens in the 2nd or 3rd inning, Sparky will then pull the platoon hitter for his backup. That burns up a PH earlier in the game that they may have had later. Doesnt work everytime but clearly it can be used to offset because the other owner doesnt know if the SP was set for 25 pitches or 80.

I am going to ignore all the background info you gave and just opine about platooning. I am like 80% sure I used opine correctly.

I play only progressives with salary cap rules but I built my teams around platoons. I would say most seasons I only have a few (2?) full time hitters. In progressives it’s just to hard to find 650+ PA guys that I want having 650+ PA. And it’s to easy to find quality guys with 200ish PA.

I think there’s a little moneyball issue there as well as those guys tend to be undervalued.

Also, there’s a significant advantage to the hitter opposite handness situations. I think it’s 7%. WiS released the formula years ago but I can’t recall exactly. If I recall correctly, Switch hitters don’t get the bonus, they just don’t get a penalty.

Posted by The_Creeper on 4/10/2024 2:21:00 PM (view original):
Another thing I have done and observed others doing to combat the excessive platoon is to play games with their Tandem pitching settings.

For example, start an average (bullpen) LH pitcher for 25-35 pitches and 3/4 to pull him for a RH stud tandem. That usually gets the heavy platooners to start a RH hitter, but then when the pitching change happens in the 2nd or 3rd inning, Sparky will then pull the platoon hitter for his backup. That burns up a PH earlier in the game that they may have had later. Doesnt work everytime but clearly it can be used to offset because the other owner doesnt know if the SP was set for 25 pitches or 80.

I also do this occasionally… and for a brilliant real life example, see Howser v Cox in games 6-7 of the 1985 ALCS

Posted by contrarian23 on 4/13/2024 1:37:00 PM (view original):

Posted by The_Creeper on 4/10/2024 2:21:00 PM (view original):
Another thing I have done and observed others doing to combat the excessive platoon is to play games with their Tandem pitching settings.

For example, start an average (bullpen) LH pitcher for 25-35 pitches and 3/4 to pull him for a RH stud tandem. That usually gets the heavy platooners to start a RH hitter, but then when the pitching change happens in the 2nd or 3rd inning, Sparky will then pull the platoon hitter for his backup. That burns up a PH earlier in the game that they may have had later. Doesnt work everytime but clearly it can be used to offset because the other owner doesnt know if the SP was set for 25 pitches or 80.

I also do this occasionally… and for a brilliant real life example, see Howser v Cox in games 6-7 of the 1985 ALCS

I don't remember that series well enough. Will have to watch it. I may have skipped it at the time because I was p.o.d the Yankees lost out to the Blue Jays by a couple of games in the Eastern Division at the time (I was 25 years old in my defense). I know the NL series that year very well, which also had some great managing tactical battles.

Posted by Trentonjoe on 4/13/2024 11:55:00 AM (view original):
I am going to ignore all the background info you gave and just opine about platooning. I am like 80% sure I used opine correctly.

I play only progressives with salary cap rules but I built my teams around platoons. I would say most seasons I only have a few (2?) full time hitters. In progressives it’s just to hard to find 650+ PA guys that I want having 650+ PA. And it’s to easy to find quality guys with 200ish PA.

I think there’s a little moneyball issue there as well as those guys tend to be undervalued.

Also, there’s a significant advantage to the hitter opposite handness situations. I think it’s 7%. WiS released the formula years ago but I can’t recall exactly. If I recall correctly, Switch hitters don’t get the bonus, they just don’t get a penalty.

Thanks! Lots of good ideas for experimenting on WIS and OOTP going forward.

I have found that I have a hard time using straight L/R platoons because I end up facing a string of one or the other in a row and then you are dealing with fatigue issues.

Posted by kneeneighbor on 4/19/2024 12:02:00 PM (view original):
I have found that I have a hard time using straight L/R platoons because I end up facing a string of one or the other in a row and then you are dealing with fatigue issues.

Good point. Though theoretically the hierarchies at each position should take care of that. In both games.

I love platooning at some positions. It keeps some players fresh and if it is warranted after enough PA data it creates an edge. Even some great players have a detrimental imbalance sometimes that suggests platooning.
So I am a big fan. In progs I almost always platoon 1-2 players. And I draft with the intent to platoon certain players.
It is a no brainer!