Posted by strikeout26 on 6/2/2022 10:52:00 PM (view original):
I stay out of "culture war" debates, as I only have so much pondering time and haven't really formed an opinion on them. I may get to them at some point, but I doubt it. They just don't seem to interest me that much.

As far as left-wingers reacting to real issues, I'm not so sure thats true. They react to media propaganda the same way the right does. I'll give you a couple of examples. Liberals were polled on what percentage of the unvaccinated they thought were hospitalized when they contracted COVID. Their response was that more than 50% of people were hospitalized. The actual answer is less than 1%. There was also a poll that asked how many unarmed black men were shot each year by cops. I don't remember liberals exact response, but it was something like 20k unarmed black people (it actually may have been a higher number, but since I don't remember exactly I tried to lowball it).. The actual answer is in the high single digits out of hundreds of millions interactions with law enforcement/year. The actual data shows the number to be in the teens, but it includes situations where the person that was shot was reaching for a cops weapon which accounted for about half of the instances.

The point is that media pushes lies becauses it sells and people eat it up without questioning whether its true or not. It doesn't matter your political persuasion, everyone is guilty. I try to listen to all viewpoints. I'll go from Ben Shapiro to Anna Kasparian to Tim Poole to John Lovett, but most people get very uncomfortable listening to viewpoints that don't reiterate their worldview. I think the only person that I can't tolerate is Hannity. I don't watch mainstream news, but on his radio show he cuts off his guests constantly. I want to hear what they have to say.

BS - you show me what media was saying that 50% of people getting covid were hospitalized. And I want to see that poll and how soon after the outbreak it was if it ever was.

How can you listen to Hannity period ?

Your stat about violence against unarmed black men is ridiculous and I would like to see that poll too.
The George death did not involve a gun.
You are always trying to distract from an inconvenient truth because you don’t like it.

Outlets like CNN and MSNBC are not pushing lies.Quite frankly if you are listening to Hannity and only complain about his rudeness you just cannot get it and probably won’t.

If you want a stat that actually is important 75% of republicans do not think that Biden won - that the election was rigged.

And during the Obama years a similar number thought he was not born in the United States.

That is the kind of stuff that is important because that stuff gets translated into action like Jan 6.

Some poll about fear of consequences about covid is a distraction from important stuff: The vast majority of the over 1 million killed were republicans refusing the vaccine. And you are belittling people who are hyper about staying safe.

Posted by strikeout26 on 6/2/2022 10:52:00 PM (view original):
I stay out of "culture war" debates, as I only have so much pondering time and haven't really formed an opinion on them. I may get to them at some point, but I doubt it. They just don't seem to interest me that much.

As far as left-wingers reacting to real issues, I'm not so sure thats true. They react to media propaganda the same way the right does. I'll give you a couple of examples. Liberals were polled on what percentage of the unvaccinated they thought were hospitalized when they contracted COVID. Their response was that more than 50% of people were hospitalized. The actual answer is less than 1%. There was also a poll that asked how many unarmed black men were shot each year by cops. I don't remember liberals exact response, but it was something like 20k unarmed black people (it actually may have been a higher number, but since I don't remember exactly I tried to lowball it).. The actual answer is in the high single digits out of hundreds of millions interactions with law enforcement/year. The actual data shows the number to be in the teens, but it includes situations where the person that was shot was reaching for a cops weapon which accounted for about half of the instances.

The point is that media pushes lies becauses it sells and people eat it up without questioning whether its true or not. It doesn't matter your political persuasion, everyone is guilty. I try to listen to all viewpoints. I'll go from Ben Shapiro to Anna Kasparian to Tim Poole to John Lovett, but most people get very uncomfortable listening to viewpoints that don't reiterate their worldview. I think the only person that I can't tolerate is Hannity. I don't watch mainstream news, but on his radio show he cuts off his guests constantly. I want to hear what they have to say.

I think you misinterpreted what I said. I'm not trying to argue that misinformation is only an issue on the right, or that the left doesn't overstate certain issues. I just think that, by and large, the left is reacting (and sometimes overreacting) to something actually happening, whereas the right gets upset over made up talking points.

COVID did happen. George Floyd was murdered. COVID and police violence are real issues, even if some people overstate their impacts. Meanwhile, the CRT outrage started from an interview on Fox News. It was a transparent attempt by a right wing propagandist to create a new culture war issue out of thin air. The groomer talking point started out of nowhere too and hasn't ever been substantiated. It's genuinely very frustrating to see a bunch of people getting whipped up into a frenzy over stuff that no one knew about two months ago and won't be an issue two months from now. Stuff like the "war on Christmas," election being rigged, Dr. Seuss being banned(?), women being raped by trans people in bathrooms, just some examples of culture war outrage bait about made up issues. It's very tiring. Obviously there are real grievances as well, but it just seems so common for these narratives to rise up out of nowhere, get a bunch of people really angry, and then disappear. I can't think of an example of a common left wing issue that originated on MSNBC or CNN.

Culture war debates are my least favorite type of discourse.

I also want to be clear that I'm not assigning any of these beliefs to you personally. It's just something I've noticed from the right wing as a whole.

BS - you show me what media was saying that 50% of people getting covid were hospitalized.

I know s/out has Jetson blocked so I'll address this. I think this data point is actually true. I don't think the media was outright saying false information about the hospitalization rate, but the coverage of COVID was played up in a way that caused a lot of left wingers to be misinformed about the severity of the virus. If you're a lay person and constantly see focus on the hospitalizations related to COVID over and over, I definitely wouldn't blame you for overstating the hospitalization rate.

I don't think this is a liberal bias thing FWIW, I think it's a perverse incentive for outrage and sensationalism that exists in all news media because they rely on clicks and watch time. Way worse outside the mainstream because there's little accountability.

Posted by tangplay on 6/3/2022 1:19:00 AM (view original):

BS - you show me what media was saying that 50% of people getting covid were hospitalized.

I know s/out has Jetson blocked so I'll address this. I think this data point is actually true. I don't think the media was outright saying false information about the hospitalization rate, but the coverage of COVID was played up in a way that caused a lot of left wingers to be misinformed about the severity of the virus. If you're a lay person and constantly see focus on the hospitalizations related to COVID over and over, I definitely wouldn't blame you for overstating the hospitalization rate.

I don't think this is a liberal bias thing FWIW, I think it's a perverse incentive for outrage and sensationalism that exists in all news media because they rely on clicks and watch time. Way worse outside the mainstream because there's little accountability.

like i said i never saw that and if it is so then when was that poll - probably within the first 3 months of the pandemic.
I watched so called liberal media and such misinformation was never out there.
If anything such data comes from lack of information but not misinformation.
So what is the worth of that example if it is true - that liberals take the pandemic so seriously that when it began we thought that the hospitalizing rate was higher then it was.

Meaningless - all it says is that the liberals believed in the danger of covid and the liberals after more then 1 million dead WERE CORRECT!

i found the poll - it was from the end of 2020 and it was 41% of dems overstating the hospitalization rate while republicans were extremely understating the efficacy of the vaccines.

I still have no idea what the significance of the dems being mistaken about a hospital rate has to do with one party spreading false and dangerous information as a political strategy.

All it says is that dems really had a healthy fear about covid and took it very very seriously.

"Just an idea, but maybe both sides should quit viewing the other as bad people and just learn to have conversations. "
Totally agree. Yes, there are bad people on the Republican side, but there are also bad people on the democratic side. There are bad people on both sides of just about any issue. I remember once saying that not everyone who voted for Trump is a racist idiot, that some of them had what they consider valid reasons for voting for him, and boy, did I get **** for saying that. Those valid reasons may not make sense to me, but that does not make them less valid for those people.

That’s my point. You committed heresy in the left’s secular religion. Fall in line or be excommunicated. You see it with a lot of disaffected old-school liberals: i.e. Bill Maher and Elon Musk.

And watch Dino prove my point with his response to this, which I may actually click on and read for a good chuckle.

Posted by wylie715 on 6/3/2022 2:12:00 PM (view original):
"Just an idea, but maybe both sides should quit viewing the other as bad people and just learn to have conversations. "
Totally agree. Yes, there are bad people on the Republican side, but there are also bad people on the democratic side. There are bad people on both sides of just about any issue. I remember once saying that not everyone who voted for Trump is a racist idiot, that some of them had what they consider valid reasons for voting for him, and boy, did I get **** for saying that. Those valid reasons may not make sense to me, but that does not make them less valid for those people.

this sounds like Trump.
” there are good people on both sides”
very simple point of view - it is not wisdom to say that.

Look at reality - do republicans in congress work in good faith - NO!

As far as rank and file citizens - they vote for the monsters in congress knowing full well what they are getting.

Whether some are good people is meaningless.
They vote for something they are getting usually rooted in some type of racism and anger but not in any type of constructive goals.
They don’t care much about collective progress - it just does not float their boat.

That’s a generalization but a pretty good one.

And I can call insurrectionists and kkk and nazis bad people and if you can’t that is on you.
There are others that I won’t consider bad people like the the KO guy but i think he is too facile with the shallow and condescending views of right wing ideology.
At some point some of these people do become bad people by the type of things they come to willingly embrace.

Posted by strikeout26 on 6/3/2022 2:19:00 PM (view original):
That’s my point. You committed heresy in the left’s secular religion. Fall in line or be excommunicated. You see it with a lot of disaffected old-school liberals: i.e. Bill Maher and Elon Musk.

And watch Dino prove my point with his response to this, which I may actually click on and read for a good chuckle.

Your patented complaints about my personality is irrelevant.
I base my conversation strictly upon what you espouse as your beliefs.
The things I read from you are deeply disturbing so in these forums I am not going to make believe that you have respectable opinions.

Like it or not I am honest.
I agree that you are more evolved then the total crazies of Dog and Lostinspace but you are still in the same room as they are watching Hannity and having a condescending view about the rights of others to want a freer and safer and normal society.

peter navarro

distinguished public servant



i hadda laugh

as in had a

and have to



what a yutz

There, you happy. I clicked on one of your posts. It will probably be the last, so I will respond because I'm sure you get tired of talking to yourself.

You don't base your conversation strictly upon my beliefs and thats because you don't know my beliefs. You are incapable of understanding my beliefs. Its not because you're stupid. It's because you're brainwashed into believing anything that doesn't conform with your worldview is evil. You find any view that is not left of Stalin "deeply disturbing." You make this clear with every one of your posts. You are a sheep. I honestly feel bad for you. If you behave in the real world the same way that you do in a silly online forum, you probably don't have many friends. You are a narcissist on here. I really hope, for your sake, that you're different when you are face to face with someone.

You are not honest. You are sincere. Big difference!!! You type what you believe to be the truth. The problem is that you can't put your ego aside long enough to actually question if your beliefs are true. As I said above, you are a sheep. You merely parrot left-wing talking points. Please, please, please start thinking for yourself.

FYI, I don't watch Hannity. Made that pretty clear already. I actually have not watched a minute of Fox News in about 7 or 8 years.

Also Dino, if you could put your hatred for people aside for 5 seconds, you might come to realize that we actually don't disagree on that much. We agree about most problems. Our disagreement comes in the form of the solution to the problem. This is consistent with most people. The problem is that people are too busy ******** at each other to be able to come up with good solutions.

Posted by strikeout26 on 6/3/2022 5:41:00 PM (view original):
There, you happy. I clicked on one of your posts. It will probably be the last, so I will respond because I'm sure you get tired of talking to yourself.

You don't base your conversation strictly upon my beliefs and thats because you don't know my beliefs. You are incapable of understanding my beliefs. Its not because you're stupid. It's because you're brainwashed into believing anything that doesn't conform with your worldview is evil. You find any view that is not left of Stalin "deeply disturbing." You make this clear with every one of your posts. You are a sheep. I honestly feel bad for you. If you behave in the real world the same way that you do in a silly online forum, you probably don't have many friends. You are a narcissist on here. I really hope, for your sake, that you're different when you are face to face with someone.

You are not honest. You are sincere. Big difference!!! You type what you believe to be the truth. The problem is that you can't put your ego aside long enough to actually question if your beliefs are true. As I said above, you are a sheep. You merely parrot left-wing talking points. Please, please, please start thinking for yourself.

FYI, I don't watch Hannity. Made that pretty clear already. I actually have not watched a minute of Fox News in about 7 or 8 years.

Also Dino, if you could put your hatred for people aside for 5 seconds, you might come to realize that we actually don't disagree on that much. We agree about most problems. Our disagreement comes in the form of the solution to the problem. This is consistent with most people. The problem is that people are too busy ******** at each other to be able to come up with good solutions.

i don’t think you are brainwashed but people of your ilk are always calling the other side sheep and brainwashed.
why is that.
You said you listen to hannity but don’t like his rudeness. i’m
If we agree on so much - who did you vote for President in 16 and 20.
surprise me.
I never intimated that I hate you.
If you disapprove of my hatred of the GOP that’s your right but I don’t know why.

why does my hatred of the GOP offend you?

Democratic politicians can’t be totally honest of how they feel about the GOP but I can and you could.
Regular people that either hate or deeply resent the GOP are the smart people of our country.
The fact that I don’t see much gray does not make ne wrong.

“I think the only person that I can't tolerate is Hannity. I don't watch mainstream news, but on his radio show he cuts off his guests constantly. I want to hear what they have to say.”

Please see above regarding what I actually said about watching Hannity.

You are a brainwashed sheep because you buy into what your leaders tell you without question. Trust me, I think the majority on the right are brainwashed sheep as well. See my post about why Trump won the nomination for my thoughts on that.

My vote will not surprise you at all. I didn’t vote for president in 2016 and I voted for Jo Jorgensen in 2020. I lean more libertarian than anything. I think most people do. They just don’t realize it.

Also, who I voted for has no relevance on what issues we do and don’t agree on. Once again, our disagreements are on policy prescriptions not problems. This, for the most part, is where the political parties dissent.

My issue with your hatred for the GOP is that means you hate just under 50% of the country. That’s not healthy for anyone. At a minimum, depending on where you live, that means at least 30% of the people that you interact with outside of your family and friend circle are going to be Republican voters and at most 65-70%. We have to live amongst each other in a civilized society. There’s no room for hate if we want to thrive as a country.

one more thing. Your recent posts about me are a million times more personal against me then anything I have said about you.
I have never called any of the posters here sheep because i believe that they are personally responsible for their beliefs and what they choose to take as information.

I am very proud that I understand the truth and never shy about saying it.
If you don’t like honest talk keep blocking me and keep calling me sheep which means you don’t like what i say….which would also mean that others around here that also despise the GOP in a less strident way are also sheep.

I have never gotten any more direct about you then to say that i don’t respect your point of view and that you speak in a very condescending manner.

Nobody around here gives a **** about the personhood of the others although when there was a life/ death issue only i showed worry and concern and human compassion. Otherwise i have sunk down to the level set by others.

In other words i don’t give a **** about your personal views of me and i don’t have any personal view about you.
The only ones that I developed a personal view of are the ones who are anti- jewish.
For the record that does not include Tangplay who is honest although I have disagreed with him.
Although I strongly disagree with him he is someone with an antipathy towards Israel but is in no way anti jewish and I regret the extent to which we once argued about a few things.
He is an honest person.

I have no respect for the views of people against the democrat’s proposals on gun safety or pro choice or wedge issue pushers like desantis and his ilk or those who deny or refuse to accept the nature of the GOP and their anti democracy agenda.

Those who are informed but not fighting to save democracy in this country are not great Americans. If I am wrong to say that please explain why?