Reserved for future delusional thoughts.

Well crafted, organized and written. Must read for anyone getting into D1, and even D1 vets who need a refresher.

PS - I can't promise I won't use your strategies against you . I need all the help I can get.

This is really great. Each section deserves its own pinned discussion thread, IMO. The game has been waiting 4+ years for someone to do a comprehensive strategy guide like this following up chapelhillne’s 3.0 guide; this is a real gift, so thank you Tex.

One clarification I’ll make to start us off - on scouting, D3 teams can’t really expect to scout more than 100-120 or so to level 4 using this method, because of how low their scouting budget is. Now that’s really plenty as long as they’re putting the pool together the right way, and targeting plenty of players likely to be in their range. Total budget divided by 200 is a good rough estimate of what your target number will be with this method (leaves a little remainder for second session emergency scouting).

This guide would’ve saved me many hours when I was first getting into this game a few months ago, and will likely save me more hours in the future. Bravo & grazi

Definitely going to read this during work tomorrow.

Maybe I am not scouting the right guys but a min of 80 for Ath/Def seems almost impossible

Posted by Fregoe on 11/19/2021 3:46:00 PM (view original):
Maybe I am not scouting the right guys but a min of 80 for Ath/Def seems almost impossible

To be clear, that is each recruit finishing their career greater than 80 in both ATH/DEF so I am taking their potential into consideration when Im listing minimums. I wanted to make sure I'm not setting unreasonable expectations (which was the one thing that annoyed me greatly about AEJones' guide). So I just went back to the rosters of my first 12 seasons at TCU in Phelan (seasons 130-141) and all 11 seasons I signed a recruit in Colorado in smith (Seasons 115-124). Those teams started at D+ and D prestige respectively and I took over with a completely SIMAI roster. Over that time I signed 54 recruits. 50 of them finished with higher than 80 in both DEF and ATH. Of the remaining 4, all had either DEF or ATH above 80. The remaining category was 78, 78, 76 and 73. 3/4 were also recruited in my first full season in D1 3.0.

I scouted and recruited all of these players using what is described it the guide. That's a long way of say, it's very possible because I did it. Admittingly, D1 world populations are up some since then. Looking at my current rebuild (also TCU), I've taken a few more players that landed in the 70s in either category (not both after the first season), but Im still consistently signing guys that finish right at or above that threshold in both categories. It's not impossible, it just has to be your focus if you want to take the route I did.

wow this is pretty neat, nice job! i only read a few sections so far, but some of it seems like really good advice. the part about the different sets and the tradeoffs sounds like it was written by someone with 20 championships. i'll get through the rest another time, good stuff

I value and appreciate ALL effort that is added for the community to read. It can only increase competition and help people want to continue playing. Having success makes you more interested. Well written. Very nice job man.

As you stated, there will be so many opinions on things that are right and wrong in this. Or acceptable and unacceptable. But this is a great starting point for any new coach regardless. (Although I love me a ****** defender! As long as he can score like crazy. I view HD more like NBA Jam than I do Ravens/Steelers defense type of game in a way. Offense offense offense! But that is what makes HD great is the many ways to win. And you can't go wrong with defensive players that can hold their own. Always a roster spot for them)

Thanks for taking the time to upload this. Hope it sticks around forever. I didn't read it all yet, but anything with this much detail is going to be useful and helpful!

Posted by gillispie on 11/19/2021 9:53:00 PM (view original):
wow this is pretty neat, nice job! i only read a few sections so far, but some of it seems like really good advice. the part about the different sets and the tradeoffs sounds like it was written by someone with 20 championships. i'll get through the rest another time, good stuff

Thanks, that means a lot especially coming from you. I would, of course, be interested in the “some of” it that’s you didn’t think was good advice. Constructive criticism is useful both for the guide but also for me getting better at the game.

ps - if you get far enough, there is a whole section dedicated to something you wrote. I only sling half an insult at your writing style :-p

Posted by topdogggbm on 11/20/2021 1:18:00 AM (view original):
I value and appreciate ALL effort that is added for the community to read. It can only increase competition and help people want to continue playing. Having success makes you more interested. Well written. Very nice job man.

As you stated, there will be so many opinions on things that are right and wrong in this. Or acceptable and unacceptable. But this is a great starting point for any new coach regardless. (Although I love me a ****** defender! As long as he can score like crazy. I view HD more like NBA Jam than I do Ravens/Steelers defense type of game in a way. Offense offense offense! But that is what makes HD great is the many ways to win. And you can't go wrong with defensive players that can hold their own. Always a roster spot for them)

Thanks for taking the time to upload this. Hope it sticks around forever. I didn't read it all yet, but anything with this much detail is going to be useful and helpful!

+1

Good for readers to hear from a coach that’s clearly more successful than me that there are one than one way to approach recruit evaluation/roster construction.

I recently took over a LSU team from Chapel, whom I believe is pretty clearly the best coach in the game currently. Unsurprisingly the roster was ten deep with only ELITE players. There was one player, David Moretz, whom was certainly a stud. Mentally though, I labeled him the “worst” of the incredible bunch because of his 73/71 ath/def and no room for growth there. Chapel was nice enough to exchange a few sitemails with me about the team. One thing he implied was Moretz was actually the best and most important of the bunch. That nearly broke my brain hearing that from him.

There’s at least two top coaches (Topp and Chapel) that don’t start their evaluation solely on 80 ATH/DEF. That doesn’t change my advice because I’ve had success my way. I like my box scores to look like Big 10 punt-fests. It’s okay that others don’t. Plenty of ways to skin this cat.

It shouldn't change you're advice. You're NOT wrong.

As far as best coach in HD.... oh man. This is by far my favorite thing to talk about! I don't wanna hijack the thread too much. Should stay on topic. But as far as HD Rushmore, the only "lock" for me in piman314. There's 10 to 15 others out there vying for those last 3 spots. Chap is one, as you mentioned. (I am NOT!). It all depends on the criteria. Variety is important to me, over "so many titles in lower divisions or one location". Would love to revisit this discussion in one of the past threads where we talked about things of this nature!

On the topic of sets, I think the differences between offensive sets is currently probably the least well understood major concept in the game by the HD community, and that’s reflected in the section in this manifesto. It’s basically like zone was 8 years ago. Folks tend to play it a certain way - like there is basically no difference between triangle, flex, and motion - and because that is 90% of what people see, most of us assume there is no real difference. But there are differences, important ones, just like there are differences between man, zone, and press. Like defense, great players will do pretty well even if you completely ignore the differences, and just throw them out there, so if your strategy is to focus all your efforts on getting the best players, and keeping the ball in their hands, you’ll do pretty well. But understanding some of the nuances of those sets, how they weigh the attributes, and how they tolerate distribution loads most efficiently, that goes a long way toward moving a coach to the next level.

I don’t have all the answers here, by any means. Only some suspicions and hunches and tendencies. But I am certain there are differences, and they are pretty important. The offensive sets aren’t just cosmetic.

Posted by texashick on 11/20/2021 9:18:00 AM (view original):

Posted by gillispie on 11/19/2021 9:53:00 PM (view original):
wow this is pretty neat, nice job! i only read a few sections so far, but some of it seems like really good advice. the part about the different sets and the tradeoffs sounds like it was written by someone with 20 championships. i'll get through the rest another time, good stuff

Thanks, that means a lot especially coming from you. I would, of course, be interested in the “some of” it that’s you didn’t think was good advice. Constructive criticism is useful both for the guide but also for me getting better at the game.

ps - if you get far enough, there is a whole section dedicated to something you wrote. I only sling half an insult at your writing style :-p

haha, that's funny. i didn't exactly mean it that way - that some of it wasn't good, although i do figure after i read it thoroughly i'll give a couple alternate takes. what i was meaning was, about half of what i read was REALLY good, and that is an accomplishment. as you alluded to, i don't hit that ratio myself ;)

the 80 ath/def is an easy target, its a good guideline, but those hard rules never hold up to scrutiny. i'll comment on it because other folks have. the law of diminishing returns is too significant, the first great bh/pass player on a team or first couple great per scorers, they are just too valuable, if it comes down to getting those things or having a 9th or 10th guy with 80 ath/def, its not even close. that said, having good defense is important, and we live in the ath/def paradigm of HD. there's no doubt that ath/def based man teams (and other sets) are very powerful, nor that having ath/def as the central pillar of your team is a very good strategy. so i think you are very much on the right track there, but that its good to be willing to sacrifice a bit of defensive ability for a player who is great in some really important way or ways.

Now we are heating up with some real thoughts which was half the reason for writing this.

Regarding offenses Shoe, what you say makes complete sense. I don’t think the game would be designed to have the offense be purely cosmetic. The problem is I’m not really smart or invested enough to eek out these differences myself and I’ve seen fairly little written that discerns much different between flex, motion and triangle. The two best sources I have is another long post by Billy/Gil that gets bumped every 6 months or so. I’m unable to find it via search but if someone has it, would love for someone to add it to this thread. Its also windy but does the best job describing the differences between the sets. I read it every time it’s bumped. About half way through reading I always think Ive learned something, but by the end I leave with little tangible goals on how to change my recruiting or strategy. Cubs spreadsheet also shows his weighting between the 3 non—FB offenses. When I look at it, there are differences but it’s hard for me to include a player that’s more significantly better or worse by changing the offense. I think some of my opinion is also shaped in my clear Défense first strategy. If that’s my primary goal, it’s rare in recruiting I’ll have two players that are close enough in defense, distance and preferences that I can weigh out a slightly higher BH vs. PER. Your sentence regarding distribution makes a lot of sense and is probably we’re the more than subtle differences are. So my question is, what are your hunches and tendencies?

Billy (or should i go with Gil? I never know) - completely agree with what you wrote. Bright lines in this game are always bad (hence my second caveat in the intro) and I’ve probably gone overboard in adhering to the 80/80 maxim and pushed it a bit to hard in the recruit evaluation section. Especially in the two instances you mentioned (an elite distributor or a 3 point bomber), I’d agree that’s worth deviating to some extent from the general principle. That said though, I click on so many D1 teams that have multiple upperclassmen with ath and/or def in the 50s/60s, that I just wouldn’t roster and I think kill those teams. My strategy is a good way to not get sucked into those players.

Thoroughly looking forward to any alternating views on this or other topics you have.