No one knows who started anything besides the dead guy and the guy that will say anything to not go to jail.

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 3:59:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 3:46:00 PM (view original):

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 3:44:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 3:25:00 PM (view original):
Are you implying that only black people can be "******* ********"?

I'll disagree.  

I am not.

Then why is "******* *******" racial profiling?

He's angry at someone he doesn't know.  Why is he angry at him?  What is he getting away with?  Why is he suspicious?  I'm arguing that the explanation is that he's black, and maybe this rash of burglaries was done by black men.  He is suspicious of him because he is black. 

I've answered this several times, BL.   A stranger walking in the rain with a concealed identity after a rash of burglaries.    GZ never mentioned race in the 911 call until he was SPECIFICALLY asked.

Posted by bad_luck on 7/16/2013 3:49:00 PM (view original):
I have a hypothetical.

What if, during the struggle, Martin took the gun away and shot Zimmerman. Two questions: do you think he would have walked free? Do you think he should have walked free?

I would assume that Martin would argue that Zimmerman chased him and started the confrontation.  But the fact that most of the eyewitness testimony has Martin placed on top of Zimmerman in the scuffle, and the fact that Zimmerman has injuries to his face and head, and Martin didn't have injuries?  I would guess he goes to jail.  There's little evidence to suggest that Martin was in real danger in this situation.

Maybe he'd argue Zimmerman pulled a gun on him and he wrestled it away.  That would make it more complicated.

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 4:04:00 PM (view original):

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 3:59:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 3:46:00 PM (view original):

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 3:44:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 3:25:00 PM (view original):
Are you implying that only black people can be "******* ********"?

I'll disagree.  

I am not.

Then why is "******* *******" racial profiling?

He's angry at someone he doesn't know.  Why is he angry at him?  What is he getting away with?  Why is he suspicious?  I'm arguing that the explanation is that he's black, and maybe this rash of burglaries was done by black men.  He is suspicious of him because he is black. 

I've answered this several times, BL.   A stranger walking in the rain with a concealed identity after a rash of burglaries.    GZ never mentioned race in the 911 call until he was SPECIFICALLY asked.

Seems odd to jump to a conclusion that some guy walking in the rain is a criminal and get worked up about it.

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 4:07:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 4:04:00 PM (view original):

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 3:59:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 3:46:00 PM (view original):

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 3:44:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 3:25:00 PM (view original):
Are you implying that only black people can be "******* ********"?

I'll disagree.  

I am not.

Then why is "******* *******" racial profiling?

He's angry at someone he doesn't know.  Why is he angry at him?  What is he getting away with?  Why is he suspicious?  I'm arguing that the explanation is that he's black, and maybe this rash of burglaries was done by black men.  He is suspicious of him because he is black. 

I've answered this several times, BL.   A stranger walking in the rain with a concealed identity after a rash of burglaries.    GZ never mentioned race in the 911 call until he was SPECIFICALLY asked.

Seems odd to jump to a conclusion that some guy walking in the rain is a criminal and get worked up about it.

No one has claimed the GZ was a rational or nice man.    I suspect he's also a ******* *******. 

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 4:07:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 7/16/2013 3:49:00 PM (view original):
I have a hypothetical.

What if, during the struggle, Martin took the gun away and shot Zimmerman. Two questions: do you think he would have walked free? Do you think he should have walked free?

I would assume that Martin would argue that Zimmerman chased him and started the confrontation.  But the fact that most of the eyewitness testimony has Martin placed on top of Zimmerman in the scuffle, and the fact that Zimmerman has injuries to his face and head, and Martin didn't have injuries?  I would guess he goes to jail.  There's little evidence to suggest that Martin was in real danger in this situation.

Maybe he'd argue Zimmerman pulled a gun on him and he wrestled it away.  That would make it more complicated.

The only living eyewitness was Zimmerman.

Do you think he should go to jail? Can't he claim self defense also, especially since it wasn't his gun? Wouldn't we need evidence that he acted criminally like everyone says we need with Zimmerman?

Posted by bad_luck on 7/16/2013 4:13:00 PM (view original):

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 4:07:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 7/16/2013 3:49:00 PM (view original):
I have a hypothetical.

What if, during the struggle, Martin took the gun away and shot Zimmerman. Two questions: do you think he would have walked free? Do you think he should have walked free?

I would assume that Martin would argue that Zimmerman chased him and started the confrontation.  But the fact that most of the eyewitness testimony has Martin placed on top of Zimmerman in the scuffle, and the fact that Zimmerman has injuries to his face and head, and Martin didn't have injuries?  I would guess he goes to jail.  There's little evidence to suggest that Martin was in real danger in this situation.

Maybe he'd argue Zimmerman pulled a gun on him and he wrestled it away.  That would make it more complicated.

The only living eyewitness was Zimmerman.

Do you think he should go to jail? Can't he claim self defense also, especially since it wasn't his gun? Wouldn't we need evidence that he acted criminally like everyone says we need with Zimmerman?

He'd definitely argue that Zimmerman pulled his gun on him.  He'd argue that Zimmerman chased him throughout the neighborhood and he hid and then surprised him.  And when Zimmerman pulled a gun, he wrestled it from him and shot him.  It all makes sense, except for the last part.  If he pulled the gun from Zimmerman, considering he was on top of him, he probably could have gotten off him, right?  Sounds like it could be manslaughter?  He didn't have to shoot him.  It would probably be a tough case to figure out.  I would guess he'd be innocent as well after thinking about this some.

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 4:04:00 PM (view original):

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 3:59:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 3:46:00 PM (view original):

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 3:44:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 3:25:00 PM (view original):
Are you implying that only black people can be "******* ********"?

I'll disagree.  

I am not.

Then why is "******* *******" racial profiling?

He's angry at someone he doesn't know.  Why is he angry at him?  What is he getting away with?  Why is he suspicious?  I'm arguing that the explanation is that he's black, and maybe this rash of burglaries was done by black men.  He is suspicious of him because he is black. 

I've answered this several times, BL.   A stranger walking in the rain with a concealed identity after a rash of burglaries.    GZ never mentioned race in the 911 call until he was SPECIFICALLY asked.

By the way, it's the 1st question asked by 911.  He brings it up later in the conversation as well.

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 4:15:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 4:10:00 PM (view original):

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 4:07:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 4:04:00 PM (view original):

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 3:59:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 3:46:00 PM (view original):

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 3:44:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 3:25:00 PM (view original):
Are you implying that only black people can be "******* ********"?

I'll disagree.  

I am not.

Then why is "******* *******" racial profiling?

He's angry at someone he doesn't know.  Why is he angry at him?  What is he getting away with?  Why is he suspicious?  I'm arguing that the explanation is that he's black, and maybe this rash of burglaries was done by black men.  He is suspicious of him because he is black. 

I've answered this several times, BL.   A stranger walking in the rain with a concealed identity after a rash of burglaries.    GZ never mentioned race in the 911 call until he was SPECIFICALLY asked.

Seems odd to jump to a conclusion that some guy walking in the rain is a criminal and get worked up about it.

No one has claimed the GZ was a rational or nice man.    I suspect he's also a ******* *******. 

Yes, an irrational ******* who likely racially profiled Trayvon Martin.

Or maybe he didn't, badluckjr.

Um...yea, maybe he didn't.  I'm arguing he did.  Obviously I don't know for sure.

I like how you take someone's argument and assume they're talking as if they think it's fact.  And your argument becomes BAHHH YOU DONT KNOW FOR SURE which is stupid.

Even if he did, is it a crime for a neighborhood watch member to profile?

Posted by bad_luck on 7/16/2013 3:49:00 PM (view original):
I have a hypothetical.

What if, during the struggle, Martin took the gun away and shot Zimmerman. Two questions: do you think he would have walked free? Do you think he should have walked free?

Mike, I'm curious what your answers are.

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 4:57:00 PM (view original):
Even if he did, is it a crime for a neighborhood watch member to profile?

As I said earlier, no.

Posted by burnsy483 on 7/16/2013 5:23:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2013 4:57:00 PM (view original):
Even if he did, is it a crime for a neighborhood watch member to profile?

As I said earlier, no.

So your point is....?

Posted by bad_luck on 7/16/2013 5:12:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 7/16/2013 3:49:00 PM (view original):
I have a hypothetical.

What if, during the struggle, Martin took the gun away and shot Zimmerman. Two questions: do you think he would have walked free? Do you think he should have walked free?

Mike, I'm curious what your answers are.

Due to the trial, I know the laws as they applied to the case in question.   I do not know the laws as they apply to your hypothetical.