Posted by bad_luck on 11/14/2017 9:12:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 11/14/2017 9:08:00 PM (view original):
How about a quote from Seaver saying that "I could never figure him out", in reference to Hutton. I can BL it into Seaver saying that Hutton was the best hitter ever.

My favorite thing about you, tec, is your absolute devotion to mike. I’ve known husbands and wives that didn’t have each other’s backs like you have mike’s.

It’s sweet. You're willing to defend him no matter what stupid **** he says.

BL is grabbing his ankles again!

BL's not exactly wrong. Let's not forget who tec really is:

Posted by bad_luck on 11/14/2017 9:12:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 11/14/2017 9:08:00 PM (view original):
How about a quote from Seaver saying that "I could never figure him out", in reference to Hutton. I can BL it into Seaver saying that Hutton was the best hitter ever.

My favorite thing about you, tec, is your absolute devotion to mike. I’ve known husbands and wives that didn’t have each other’s backs like you have mike’s.

It’s sweet. You're willing to defend him no matter what stupid **** he says.

Pretty sure tec is attacking the stupid **** you say. Which is plentiful.

But, if you really want to play that game, where's your girlfriend dahs? She only half-assedly defends you, mostly because your dumbassery is indefensible, but she tries really hard.

You’re right that dahs isn’t dedicated to me like tec is dedicated to you.

I remember when you claimed the government could erase the deficit by issuing more debt. When I responded with something like “what the ****?!?” tec stepped right up and accused me of not understanding the topic.

He was trying to take that bullet for you. He should have gotten more recognition for that.

• Ortiz is 100% going to the HoF based on his post season success coupled with his in season numbers. DH or not. If Relievers can go to the HoF so can DHs.
• I didn't see Edgar play enough but three of the best pitchers of his generation call him one of the greatest if not the greatest hitters in the 90s...Johnson, Pedro, Mariano. I think his numbers are good enough to get him in. He was not worse than Jim Rice and better than Dawson.

Edgar will not ever be in the HOF. His are certainly good enough in my opinion, but the voters will see 309 career HR's from a DH and that will be the end of the story for him.

Posted by cccp1014 on 11/15/2017 10:00:00 AM (view original):

• Ortiz is 100% going to the HoF based on his post season success coupled with his in season numbers. DH or not. If Relievers can go to the HoF so can DHs.
• I didn't see Edgar play enough but three of the best pitchers of his generation call him one of the greatest if not the greatest hitters in the 90s...Johnson, Pedro, Mariano. I think his numbers are good enough to get him in. He was not worse than Jim Rice and better than Dawson.

not that I think Rice and Dawson belong, but they both did something Martinez did not. Played a position on the field.

Posted by wylie715 on 11/15/2017 12:24:00 PM (view original):

Posted by cccp1014 on 11/15/2017 10:00:00 AM (view original):

• Ortiz is 100% going to the HoF based on his post season success coupled with his in season numbers. DH or not. If Relievers can go to the HoF so can DHs.
• I didn't see Edgar play enough but three of the best pitchers of his generation call him one of the greatest if not the greatest hitters in the 90s...Johnson, Pedro, Mariano. I think his numbers are good enough to get him in. He was not worse than Jim Rice and better than Dawson.

not that I think Rice and Dawson belong, but they both did something Martinez did not. Played a position on the field.

We know that DH's are eligible for the hall of fame. I agree that we should take it into account when evaluating their cases, but as long as the DH provided enough value with the bat to offset the fact that they didn't play defense, they should be in.

Martinez did that.

Not that Rice is a litmus test for HOF candidacy, but Martinez certainly provided more value with the bat alone than Rice provided with the bat + defense.

Ultimately, DH is a position. Along with the best overall players, the best players at each position should be represented in the Hall. If the best LF of all-time happened to be the 200th best player of all-time, he should still be in the Hall as the best to ever play his position.

The top 3-5 DHs of all time should be in. Who those are is up for debate.

Not saying DHs shouldn't be in the Hall, but to me, they have to be fantastic hitters to make up for the fact that they don't play defense.
Rice shouldn't be in the Hall anyway.

Posted by The Taint on 11/15/2017 1:38:00 AM (view original):
like it or not. DH is part of the game. To ignore that is asinine.

Not as big a part as FIELDING. To ignore that is BL-ish

Clarity for me, are we arguing that he should be in the hall or will be in the hall?

Posted by wylie715 on 11/15/2017 2:43:00 PM (view original):
Not saying DHs shouldn't be in the Hall, but to me, they have to be fantastic hitters to make up for the fact that they don't play defense.
Rice shouldn't be in the Hall anyway.

This is pretty much what I've been saying. Given the size of the HOF, it should be reserved for the top 1-2% of the players (IMO). The number isn't absolute, but if they're abrogating 50% of their job, they'd better be close to the top 1% of hitters in their generation to even be considered. Papi doesn't qualify, neither does Edgar.

Posted by wylie715 on 11/15/2017 2:43:00 PM (view original):
Not saying DHs shouldn't be in the Hall, but to me, they have to be fantastic hitters to make up for the fact that they don't play defense.
Rice shouldn't be in the Hall anyway.

I think EM was a fantastic hitter.

Posted by bad_luck on 11/15/2017 3:21:00 PM (view original):

Posted by wylie715 on 11/15/2017 2:43:00 PM (view original):
Not saying DHs shouldn't be in the Hall, but to me, they have to be fantastic hitters to make up for the fact that they don't play defense.
Rice shouldn't be in the Hall anyway.

I think EM was a fantastic hitter.

Do you really? Thanks for clearing that up. I suspect no one knew that until just now.