Trump: Worst President Ever? Topic

Posted by MikeT23 on 3/17/2017 12:57:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 3/17/2017 12:33:00 PM (view original):
Of course not. I'm saying that our vetting system is already effective. No need to ban Muslims.
We could do better even without a ban.

And, FWIW, I say the same thing about gun control. We can, and should, do better with who we allow to buy guns.
It's two separate issues: 1) should we ban Muslims 2) can we vet immigrants better

The answer to 1 is clearly no. Using a religious test on immigrants is un-American.

The answer to 2 is probably. But whether or not we should do it depends on what the vetting is and what it will cost, in terms of actual dollars and in terms of our way of life.

For example, we could hire a special investigator to investigate all visa applications. That investigator could fly to the applicant's home, interview the applicant, his family, his friends, his boss, search his house, review his financial/medical/communication records, and follow him around for a couple weeks. That would be a pretty effective vetting process. Some might even call it extreme. It would definitely make us safer from whatever danger a visa holder might pose.

But there are 6 million visa applications a year. So we'd need a shitload of investigators and the cost for this program would be north of a bazillion dollars. We'd be better off spending that money on healthcare for Americans, since not having health coverage is much bigger threat to Americans than terrorism will every be. The point is, we can always do better, but better is not always the best choice.
3/17/2017 1:14 PM
Americans killed by terrorists don't require health care.
3/17/2017 1:16 PM
Posted by tecwrg on 3/17/2017 1:06:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 3/16/2017 7:14:00 PM (view original):
Posted by toddcommish on 3/16/2017 7:07:00 PM (view original):
Posted by crazystengel on 3/16/2017 6:30:00 PM (view original):
Posted by toddcommish on 3/16/2017 6:00:00 PM (view original):
Posted by crazystengel on 3/16/2017 4:19:00 PM (view original):
I don't get why Mike pretends to be ignorant. Weird shtick he's got going on here, but there's no point in debating someone like that. At least todd's not pretending.
Hey, waitaminnit...
Consider it a compliment -- you're sincere! I respect that. As opposed to a troll taking positions he knows are BS just to get reactions.
ICYMI, I didn't vote for Trump either. But I also think that the blatant media liberal slant help get him elected. A lot of non-BL/Bracco people (whether because they're well-informed or just pig-headed) don't like it when traditionally impartial sources overtly take political positions, and skew their "news" toward attack pieces.

BL calls it "journalism"

Trump didn't win because the media slants liberal. Trump won because 1) there are plenty of morons voting and 2) a lot of people on the left stayed home.

This election wasn't some sort of statement about American values or being fed up with the establishment, it was apathy. Enough people shrugged their shoulders on election day that the guy who lost the popular vote by several million was able to squeak by on a slim margin in a few states and land in the very famous White House.
You need to take your head out of the sand.

Trump was a horrible candidate. But the primary reason why he won was because the Democratic Party ran a near equally horrible candidate against him, somebody who the public did not like and did not trust. Somebody who was perceived as being in the pockets of Wall Street, Somebody who was perceived as one who felt entitled to become Madame President because of who she was.

If you and the Democratic Party leadership continue to fail to acknowledge this, then you've learned absolutely nothing from this past election. Nothing.
See where I wrote: a lot of people on the left stayed home?

Yeah, Clinton was an unpopular candidate who ran a bad campaign. No one denies that.

The irony in the perception of her as an untrustworthy, corrupt, Wall St. shill...is that is exactly what we got with Trump. With the added bonus of incompetence.
3/17/2017 1:23 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 3/17/2017 1:23:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 3/17/2017 1:06:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 3/16/2017 7:14:00 PM (view original):
Posted by toddcommish on 3/16/2017 7:07:00 PM (view original):
Posted by crazystengel on 3/16/2017 6:30:00 PM (view original):
Posted by toddcommish on 3/16/2017 6:00:00 PM (view original):
Posted by crazystengel on 3/16/2017 4:19:00 PM (view original):
I don't get why Mike pretends to be ignorant. Weird shtick he's got going on here, but there's no point in debating someone like that. At least todd's not pretending.
Hey, waitaminnit...
Consider it a compliment -- you're sincere! I respect that. As opposed to a troll taking positions he knows are BS just to get reactions.
ICYMI, I didn't vote for Trump either. But I also think that the blatant media liberal slant help get him elected. A lot of non-BL/Bracco people (whether because they're well-informed or just pig-headed) don't like it when traditionally impartial sources overtly take political positions, and skew their "news" toward attack pieces.

BL calls it "journalism"

Trump didn't win because the media slants liberal. Trump won because 1) there are plenty of morons voting and 2) a lot of people on the left stayed home.

This election wasn't some sort of statement about American values or being fed up with the establishment, it was apathy. Enough people shrugged their shoulders on election day that the guy who lost the popular vote by several million was able to squeak by on a slim margin in a few states and land in the very famous White House.
You need to take your head out of the sand.

Trump was a horrible candidate. But the primary reason why he won was because the Democratic Party ran a near equally horrible candidate against him, somebody who the public did not like and did not trust. Somebody who was perceived as being in the pockets of Wall Street, Somebody who was perceived as one who felt entitled to become Madame President because of who she was.

If you and the Democratic Party leadership continue to fail to acknowledge this, then you've learned absolutely nothing from this past election. Nothing.
See where I wrote: a lot of people on the left stayed home?

Yeah, Clinton was an unpopular candidate who ran a bad campaign. No one denies that.

The irony in the perception of her as an untrustworthy, corrupt, Wall St. shill...is that is exactly what we got with Trump. With the added bonus of incompetence.
You say this like it means something. A lot of people stay home every election.

Did you know that, percentage-wise, more people voted in 2016 than 2012? Oh, and more people voted too. I didn't check but I bet 2008 is one of the few times a greater percentage voted.
3/17/2017 1:50 PM
2000 less
2004 more
2008 more
2012 less

Oh, well, I guess you need a better excuse.
3/17/2017 1:53 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/17/2017 1:53:00 PM (view original):
2000 less
2004 more
2008 more
2012 less

Oh, well, I guess you need a better excuse.
Excuse for what?
3/17/2017 1:55 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/17/2017 1:16:00 PM (view original):
Americans killed by terrorists don't require health care.
How many terrorist attacks have come from the countries Trump has banned?
3/17/2017 1:57 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 3/17/2017 1:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/17/2017 1:53:00 PM (view original):
2000 less
2004 more
2008 more
2012 less

Oh, well, I guess you need a better excuse.
Excuse for what?
Why Hillary lost. You keep repeating, 4+ months and counting, "because a lot of people stayed home."
3/17/2017 2:02 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/17/2017 2:02:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 3/17/2017 1:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/17/2017 1:53:00 PM (view original):
2000 less
2004 more
2008 more
2012 less

Oh, well, I guess you need a better excuse.
Excuse for what?
Why Hillary lost. You keep repeating, 4+ months and counting, "because a lot of people stayed home."
That's why she lost. People didn't vote for her. She didn't inspire people the same way Obama did and a lot people who were Bernie supporters decided to cut off their noses to spite their faces.
3/17/2017 2:08 PM
To those who voted for DT because they had what they thought were understandable reasons:
* Remember when the President said he wasn't going to take a salary? He just accepted his second paycheck.
* Remember when he said Mexico was going to pay for the wall? He has asked Congress to appropriate the $25 billion of taxpayer money to cover costs.
* Remember when he said he wasn't going to go on vacation or play golf? 5 of the last 7 weekends he went on vacation and played golf, ...costing taxpayers $11.1 million.
* Remember when he said he was going to use American steel to build these dangerous pipelines? Russian steel arrived last week for the Keystone Pipeline XL.
* Remember when he said he wasn't going to cut social security and Medicare? The Republican bill does just this.
* Remember when he said that nobody on his campaign had any communications with the Russian government? 7 of his people have now admitted they spoke and/or met with Russian officials after they lied and got caught.
* Remember when he said he was going to divest from his businesses? Changed his mind.
* Remember when he said he was going to release his tax returns? Changed his mind.
* Remember when he said he was going to drain the swamp of Washington insiders? His cabinet is filled with lobbyists, oil and Wall Street executives.
* Remember when he said would defeat ISIS in 30 days? He doesn't have a plan.
* Remember when he said that the Obamacare replacement would cover more people at lower cost? The AHCA that the GOP and 45 are now pushing; they now admit will cover fewer people at a higher cost.
If you voted for him, please hold him accountable to what he promised you - for all of our sakes.
Feel free to copy and paste, as I have.
3/17/2017 2:25 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 3/17/2017 2:08:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/17/2017 2:02:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 3/17/2017 1:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/17/2017 1:53:00 PM (view original):
2000 less
2004 more
2008 more
2012 less

Oh, well, I guess you need a better excuse.
Excuse for what?
Why Hillary lost. You keep repeating, 4+ months and counting, "because a lot of people stayed home."
That's why she lost. People didn't vote for her. She didn't inspire people the same way Obama did and a lot people who were Bernie supporters decided to cut off their noses to spite their faces.
She lost because she was a ****** candidate. She lost (at least partially) because she thought she already won, and ran like an incumbent instead of a ****** candidate that needed to WORK. She lost because she was a known liar (going against a megalomaniacal ********), and didn't do a damn thing to prove otherwise. She lost (at least partially) because some listened to the media and thought she was a shoo-in [you see how I brought that full circle?]
3/17/2017 3:01 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 3/17/2017 2:08:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/17/2017 2:02:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 3/17/2017 1:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/17/2017 1:53:00 PM (view original):
2000 less
2004 more
2008 more
2012 less

Oh, well, I guess you need a better excuse.
Excuse for what?
Why Hillary lost. You keep repeating, 4+ months and counting, "because a lot of people stayed home."
That's why she lost. People didn't vote for her. She didn't inspire people the same way Obama did and a lot people who were Bernie supporters decided to cut off their noses to spite their faces.
"People didn't vote for her." PURE GENIUS!!! When did you come up with that one?

A lower percentage of the population came out in 2012. Who was on that ticket? Same in 2000.

A lot of people stay home.
3/17/2017 3:20 PM
It's funny to see BL's rationale for the failed election. Even if you follow HIS "reasoning", Democrats lost because they didn't vote.

So it's their fault. But they still blame Trump and everyone else.

Look in the mirror, liberals (or watch CNN and MSNBC and read every newspaper or HuffPost). You did this to yourselves.
3/17/2017 3:31 PM
Posted by toddcommish on 3/17/2017 3:01:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 3/17/2017 2:08:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/17/2017 2:02:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 3/17/2017 1:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/17/2017 1:53:00 PM (view original):
2000 less
2004 more
2008 more
2012 less

Oh, well, I guess you need a better excuse.
Excuse for what?
Why Hillary lost. You keep repeating, 4+ months and counting, "because a lot of people stayed home."
That's why she lost. People didn't vote for her. She didn't inspire people the same way Obama did and a lot people who were Bernie supporters decided to cut off their noses to spite their faces.
She lost because she was a ****** candidate. She lost (at least partially) because she thought she already won, and ran like an incumbent instead of a ****** candidate that needed to WORK. She lost because she was a known liar (going against a megalomaniacal ********), and didn't do a damn thing to prove otherwise. She lost (at least partially) because some listened to the media and thought she was a shoo-in [you see how I brought that full circle?]
Sure. The point of my original post wasn't to make excuses for Clinton. It was to point out that Trump's election wasn't some sort of referendum on US politics.

For example, 08 was an election about change. The majority of people were unhappy with W and enthusiastically elected Obama. That wasn't the case in 16.
3/17/2017 3:38 PM
Yet a lower percentage came out to vote for Obama(2012) and Dubya(2000) than the Hillary/Trump debacle.

A lot of people stayed home in those elections too.
3/17/2017 3:40 PM
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Trump: Worst President Ever? Topic

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