Obama: Worst President Ever? Topic

MikeT23
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FWIW, I think you're having trouble accepting is that what you're spouting are idyllic thoughts that are in no way real world truths.
5/10/2012 1:37 PM
jrd_x
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Posted by MikeT23 on 5/10/2012 1:37:00 PM (view original):
FWIW, I think you're having trouble accepting is that what you're spouting are idyllic thoughts that are in no way real world truths.
From the Federal appeals court ruling on prop 8:

     “Although the Constitution permits communities to enact most laws they believe to be desirable, it requires that there be at least a legitimate reason      for the passage of a law that treats different classes of people differently,” Judge Stephen R. Reinhardt wrote in the decision. “There was no such reason      that Proposition 8 could have been enacted.”
Seems like a real world truth to me.

 

5/10/2012 1:42 PM
MikeT23
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Yet more than half the states have laws banning SSM and some even have laws banning civil unions of same sex couples.

Go figure.
5/10/2012 1:53 PM
jrd_x
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Posted by MikeT23 on 5/10/2012 1:53:00 PM (view original):
Yet more than half the states have laws banning SSM and some even have laws banning civil unions of same sex couples.

Go figure.
Jim Crow laws were also prolific at one point in time.  I guess you think those laws were valid too?
5/10/2012 1:56 PM
MikeT23
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No one is introducing Jim Crow laws today, are they?
5/10/2012 2:53 PM
jrd_x
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They are not.  But at one point they were passed in mutliple states.  Were Jim Crow laws valid because they had majority support?
5/10/2012 4:09 PM
MikeT23
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Were they passing Jim Crow laws in some states while others were going thru a repeal process?

The point is that some lawmakers, supported by the people, believe they have ground to stand on wrt SSM. 
5/10/2012 4:20 PM
jrd_x
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Posted by MikeT23 on 5/10/2012 4:20:00 PM (view original):
Were they passing Jim Crow laws in some states while others were going thru a repeal process?

The point is that some lawmakers, supported by the people, believe they have ground to stand on wrt SSM. 
Lawmaker or popular support are irrelevant if the law is unconstitutional.
5/10/2012 4:23 PM
MikeT23
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Idyllic thoughts yet again.
5/10/2012 4:30 PM
jrd_x
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That's the way it works.  Laws are subject to judicial review.  They are overturned all the time. Prop 8 was overturned for this exact reason in March. How is that idyllic?

I think you're the one with misguided ideas about the will of the people.


5/10/2012 4:35 PM
tecwrg
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Posted by jrd_x on 5/10/2012 4:23:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 5/10/2012 4:20:00 PM (view original):
Were they passing Jim Crow laws in some states while others were going thru a repeal process?

The point is that some lawmakers, supported by the people, believe they have ground to stand on wrt SSM. 
Lawmaker or popular support are irrelevant if the law is unconstitutional.
And who determines if a law is constitutional or not?  Either elected officials, or political appointees who have been specifically selected because of their political leanings.

Nope, no potential bias there.
5/10/2012 4:37 PM
jrd_x
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Posted by tecwrg on 5/10/2012 4:37:00 PM (view original):
Posted by jrd_x on 5/10/2012 4:23:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 5/10/2012 4:20:00 PM (view original):
Were they passing Jim Crow laws in some states while others were going thru a repeal process?

The point is that some lawmakers, supported by the people, believe they have ground to stand on wrt SSM. 
Lawmaker or popular support are irrelevant if the law is unconstitutional.
And who determines if a law is constitutional or not?  Either elected officials, or political appointees who have been specifically selected because of their political leanings.

Nope, no potential bias there.
Judges determine constitutionality.  It can be appealed all the way to the Supreme Court.  If you want to argue that judicial review is problematic, I guess you can, but people smarter and better educated than us have already come to an agreement on it for the most part.
5/10/2012 4:42 PM
MikeT23
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This seems like a Bible argument.

Religinuts:  The Bible is the word of God!!
Me:  Written by?
Religinuts:   Men who God spoke to!!
Me:  Maybe those men had agendas?

Kind of like judges and politicians might just have agendas.
5/10/2012 5:27 PM
jrd_x
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The difference is that our laws are based on the constitution, not the bible.  That's a rather large distinction.
5/10/2012 5:30 PM
toddcommish
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Do you think the founding fathers were in favor of same-sex marriage?

Why are you being selective in how deeply you interpret what was written 230 years ago by old, white dudes?
5/10/2012 5:32 PM
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