Ferguson Police should be outlawed Topic

burnsy483
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Posted by MikeT23 on 12/5/2014 3:56:00 PM (view original):
Also, most people aren't dumb enough to resist arrest but, for some reason, Garner did.   

Are you saying he's dumb?
Generally, attacking a police officer could result you in being beat up a little bit, maybe even killed. No sympathy for Brown, we discussed that.

Resisting arrest by raising your hands in the air does not mean he's about to fight you.  Dumb, but not so dumb that he's willing to get hurt. I got no indication watching the video that he was about to attack a police officer. I'm surprised you do.
12/5/2014 3:59 PM
MikeT23
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Posted by burnsy483 on 12/5/2014 3:59:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 12/5/2014 3:56:00 PM (view original):
Also, most people aren't dumb enough to resist arrest but, for some reason, Garner did.   

Are you saying he's dumb?
Generally, attacking a police officer could result you in being beat up a little bit, maybe even killed. No sympathy for Brown, we discussed that.

Resisting arrest by raising your hands in the air does not mean he's about to fight you.  Dumb, but not so dumb that he's willing to get hurt. I got no indication watching the video that he was about to attack a police officer. I'm surprised you do.

I guess I'll say it again.  I got the indication that he did not want to be arrested.   Once the cops decide that they are going to arrest you, I'm not sure they change their mind.  

What do you think was going to happen eventually?

Again, you act or you react.    When you're dealing with someone twice your size, it's better to act.

12/5/2014 4:03 PM
burnsy483
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Posted by MikeT23 on 12/5/2014 4:03:00 PM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 12/5/2014 3:59:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 12/5/2014 3:56:00 PM (view original):
Also, most people aren't dumb enough to resist arrest but, for some reason, Garner did.   

Are you saying he's dumb?
Generally, attacking a police officer could result you in being beat up a little bit, maybe even killed. No sympathy for Brown, we discussed that.

Resisting arrest by raising your hands in the air does not mean he's about to fight you.  Dumb, but not so dumb that he's willing to get hurt. I got no indication watching the video that he was about to attack a police officer. I'm surprised you do.

I guess I'll say it again.  I got the indication that he did not want to be arrested.   Once the cops decide that they are going to arrest you, I'm not sure they change their mind.  

What do you think was going to happen eventually?

Again, you act or you react.    When you're dealing with someone twice your size, it's better to act.

Eventually? The 4 cops would arrest this person, and they would have used techniques that were allowed by the NYPD and didn't result in his death. It probably would have taken a few more seconds. 

If he starts swinging, I get using the force necessary to bring him down. I don't think cops are trained to "attack now, there's a chance he might attack me" like you're suggesting. 
12/5/2014 4:09 PM
MikeT23
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Posted by burnsy483 on 12/5/2014 4:09:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 12/5/2014 4:03:00 PM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 12/5/2014 3:59:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 12/5/2014 3:56:00 PM (view original):
Also, most people aren't dumb enough to resist arrest but, for some reason, Garner did.   

Are you saying he's dumb?
Generally, attacking a police officer could result you in being beat up a little bit, maybe even killed. No sympathy for Brown, we discussed that.

Resisting arrest by raising your hands in the air does not mean he's about to fight you.  Dumb, but not so dumb that he's willing to get hurt. I got no indication watching the video that he was about to attack a police officer. I'm surprised you do.

I guess I'll say it again.  I got the indication that he did not want to be arrested.   Once the cops decide that they are going to arrest you, I'm not sure they change their mind.  

What do you think was going to happen eventually?

Again, you act or you react.    When you're dealing with someone twice your size, it's better to act.

Eventually? The 4 cops would arrest this person, and they would have used techniques that were allowed by the NYPD and didn't result in his death. It probably would have taken a few more seconds. 

If he starts swinging, I get using the force necessary to bring him down. I don't think cops are trained to "attack now, there's a chance he might attack me" like you're suggesting. 
You consider that an "attack"?    He was attempting to take him down in the least harmful, painless way possible.   A taser or baton to the knee would have accomplished that same thing but that's a lot more painful for the average person. 
12/5/2014 4:18 PM
burnsy483
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No, being killed by choking was painless, I'm sure.

I've grown tired of this, and we obviously see different things here. Have a good weekend.
12/5/2014 4:20 PM
MikeT23
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Posted by burnsy483 on 12/5/2014 4:20:00 PM (view original):
No, being killed by choking was painless, I'm sure.

I've grown tired of this, and we obviously see different things here. Have a good weekend.
Yeah, you slowly black out.   Being unable to breathe is sort of the purpose of a choking. 
12/5/2014 4:21 PM
bad_luck
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Posted by MikeT23 on 12/5/2014 4:21:00 PM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 12/5/2014 4:20:00 PM (view original):
No, being killed by choking was painless, I'm sure.

I've grown tired of this, and we obviously see different things here. Have a good weekend.
Yeah, you slowly black out.   Being unable to breathe is sort of the purpose of a choking. 
He died. I'm sure he would have preferred just about any other method. Especially since the NYPD is not allowed to use choke holds.

There's probably a reason for that restriction. Yet you want to just give cops a blank check to use whatever force they want.
12/5/2014 4:23 PM
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examinerebb
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The NYPD is now saying that the maneuver the officer used is not one of the banned choke-holds, and is an approved maneuver.  Of course, they may have had a different opinion before they were defending one of their own.

I saw the video for the first time last night.  The choke-hold didn't bother me.  That was a big dude and, if he's resisting arrest, you have to find a way to subdue him.  That said, WTF were the other three cops doing?  Once he was on the ground, it looked like it would have been incredibly easy to get cuffs on him fairly quickly.  Cuff him immediately, break the hold and get him to the car.  That hold was held WAY longer than it needed to be.  That was my immediate reaction and, again, I've only seen it once.

I don't see maliciousness in this or the Brown (12 shots at an unarmed man) case.  I see police incompetence.  I'm honestly not sure which is worse.
12/5/2014 6:50 PM
bad_luck
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Posted by examinerebb on 12/5/2014 6:50:00 PM (view original):
The NYPD is now saying that the maneuver the officer used is not one of the banned choke-holds, and is an approved maneuver.  Of course, they may have had a different opinion before they were defending one of their own.

I saw the video for the first time last night.  The choke-hold didn't bother me.  That was a big dude and, if he's resisting arrest, you have to find a way to subdue him.  That said, WTF were the other three cops doing?  Once he was on the ground, it looked like it would have been incredibly easy to get cuffs on him fairly quickly.  Cuff him immediately, break the hold and get him to the car.  That hold was held WAY longer than it needed to be.  That was my immediate reaction and, again, I've only seen it once.

I don't see maliciousness in this or the Brown (12 shots at an unarmed man) case.  I see police incompetence.  I'm honestly not sure which is worse.
I don't see maliciousness in this. But I do see manslaughter. Or at least reckless endangerment.
12/5/2014 7:01 PM
DougOut
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  FINALLY!  We're off Ferguson and on to a real issue.  One that has merit.  And so we go to the heart of the issue.  

  Why did some guy die over a misdemeanor?  Simple.

  The liberals murdered another black man.

  This one was the easiest to figure out since it was so in your face obvious.  
12/5/2014 7:31 PM
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bad_luck
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And, you know, don't kill people.
12/6/2014 1:09 PM
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