Yeah, you pretty much nailed it when you said "90 pages of circlejerk".   I just didn't know you were going to be a new version of badluck when you posted it.

Short version, I'll use small words for you, is that Hobby Lobby invests in 401k plans with pharm companies.  Companies that produce/distribute products they object to.  Of course, they also produce/create a lot of other products too.   No idea the percentage invested in objectionable products.

Should they?   If they want to take a moral high ground, I don't think so.  But, I assume, the pharm co make a lot of money because the people want these products.  That's good for HL employees and bad for public relations.

Anything else you need to know?

I'll ask this also.   Do you have a 401k plan or any mutual funds?   Do you know what products are produced/distributed by the companies involved?  

It's entirely possible that investment advisors do all the 401k work.    Will they continue that path?   Depends on how serious HL takes the grief they're getting for said 401k plans. 

Posted by tecwrg on 7/9/2014 3:06:00 PM (view original):

Posted by The Taint on 7/9/2014 2:18:00 PM (view original):
How do you know they're never going to use an option?

Would a single man get an abortion?

Are they always going to be single?

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/9/2014 3:13:00 PM (view original):
I'll ask this also.   Do you have a 401k plan or any mutual funds?   Do you know what products are produced/distributed by the companies involved?  

It's entirely possible that investment advisors do all the 401k work.    Will they continue that path?   Depends on how serious HL takes the grief they're getting for said 401k plans. 

I'll answer this:  No, you don't.

I have an investment guy and, every now and then, we'll review what I'm in.   Any changes are based on returns not what's being done with the money.

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/9/2014 3:13:00 PM (view original):
I'll ask this also.   Do you have a 401k plan or any mutual funds?   Do you know what products are produced/distributed by the companies involved?  

It's entirely possible that investment advisors do all the 401k work.    Will they continue that path?   Depends on how serious HL takes the grief they're getting for said 401k plans. 

Yes and yes.

And I'm not outraged by anything enough to take it to the Supreme Court. You would think that if someone was that outraged they wouldn't support companies that fed their outrage. Your argument is dumb.

As the article you posted said, there are at least two investment companies that specialiZe in making sure their are no "religiously wrong" investments in a 401k portfolio.

I know everything my 401k invests in.

So investing in contraceptives is good for the employees but providing them to said employees is bad.


Stop now, just stop.

Well, A) I don't believe you.   If you're that deep into your investments, you should probably open an investment firm.  You're doing a lot of work.   B) As I said, it's entirely possible that HL is more like 99% of investors in 401k/mutuals.   They just look at dollar signs and don't do all the extra work you put in.

Posted by The Taint on 7/9/2014 3:22:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 7/9/2014 3:06:00 PM (view original):

Posted by The Taint on 7/9/2014 2:18:00 PM (view original):
How do you know they're never going to use an option?

Would a single man get an abortion?

Are they always going to be single?

If they get married, it's a lifestyle change.  They can add a spouse to their coverage.  In an a-la-carte system, I would also allow them to be able to add certain additional coverages for the spouse.

Posted by The Taint on 7/9/2014 3:27:00 PM (view original):
So investing in contraceptives is good for the employees but providing them to said employees is bad.


Stop now, just stop.

So, if you're employed by HL, would you want them doing their best with your 401k money?   Or would you prefer they limit your earnings due to their religious beliefs?

And, again, a 401k investment in Teva is not a 100% investment in Plan B pills.    Teva develops/produces other products. 

Again, maybe HL shouldn't do that if they're making a "religious belief" stand.    And, when the dust settles, maybe they won't.

I don't care what you believe. You've never met my wife.

99 percent of investors don't have cases in front of the Supreme Court where their " moral beliefs" and "investment beliefs" are exact opposites.

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/9/2014 3:32:00 PM (view original):

Posted by The Taint on 7/9/2014 3:27:00 PM (view original):
So investing in contraceptives is good for the employees but providing them to said employees is bad.


Stop now, just stop.

So, if you're employed by HL, would you want them doing their best with your 401k money?   Or would you prefer they limit your earnings due to their religious beliefs?

I'd wish they looked at my health care the same way they looked at the health of my portfolio. And let's not pretend that they aren't making any money off the investments either. Read the article.

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/9/2014 3:32:00 PM (view original):

Posted by The Taint on 7/9/2014 3:27:00 PM (view original):
So investing in contraceptives is good for the employees but providing them to said employees is bad.


Stop now, just stop.

So, if you're employed by HL, would you want them doing their best with your 401k money?   Or would you prefer they limit your earnings due to their religious beliefs?

I'll answer this:

Yes, I want them to invest in whatever companies that will bring me the most money.    I may want them to cover my Plan B pills with health insurance but, if they refuse, I still want them to invest my 401k money so that it earns the most possible.   It's two seperate issues. 

Posted by The Taint on 7/9/2014 3:44:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 7/9/2014 3:32:00 PM (view original):

Posted by The Taint on 7/9/2014 3:27:00 PM (view original):
So investing in contraceptives is good for the employees but providing them to said employees is bad.


Stop now, just stop.

So, if you're employed by HL, would you want them doing their best with your 401k money?   Or would you prefer they limit your earnings due to their religious beliefs?

I'd wish they looked at my health care the same way they looked at the health of my portfolio. And let's not pretend that they aren't making any money off the investments either. Read the article.

Who's pretending that?  Anyone who receives a check from HL and invests money in their 401k plans makes money. 

If they refuse to look at your health care the same way they look at the health of your portfolio, what would you prefer?  
A)  Make the most money possible
B)  Limit my earnings based on religious beliefs