2/25/2013 12:53 AM (edited)
Just for fun I ran some test games without my best DL in the depth chart and he still ended up in the game and made the most tackles. He shouldn't have been in. What's the deal? It is only pulling from my defensive tackle settings and not using my defensive end settings.
2/25/2013 1:54 AM
I have not had this issue, but there does appear to be a glitch between the way players are setup in a defensive formation, and the way they actually appear when looking at the personel on the field during a game. For example, in the Nickel defense at the defensive formations screen, the 5 defensive backs are listed as 1. Corner, 2. Corner, 3. Corner, 4. Safety, 5. Safety. When looking at the PBP for a game, the DBs on the field in the Nickel defense are listed as 1. Corner, 2. Corner, 3. Safety, 4. Safety, 5. Corner. I take this to mean that the player that you wanted to be your 3rd corner is actually playing safety and the guy you wanted as your 2nd safety is actually playing corner. It isn't a big deal, and may not make any difference at all, but it is worth noting.

I see something similar happening with my LBers in the 4-4, so I'm sure it is happening at LB and DB in multiple formations.
2/25/2013 10:14 AM
I'll have to check that on the DBs.  I know I just went through checking the offense and we had a bug but I thought it fixed it for both offense and defense, but I will check.

One thing about the depth charts and players on the bench - This engine is similar to the past engines in that it will fill in your depth chart with players on the bench, so players that are not listed in your depth chart will be added to the depth chart when the game is loaded.  The one difference in this engine is it fills them in based on your default position role rating, rather than randomly filling them in like the past engines.  However, it should still bring in the guys you actually have listed in the depth chart before these newly added players, and only bring in the new players when those players are set to rest.

2/25/2013 11:12 AM
I just looked into this again. Tackles set D1 to D4 were the way the game play had them set, D1 to D4 and none of my DE got in the game. Checked all my depth charts and play formation and they have DT and DE designated.
2/25/2013 8:00 PM
Tried again. Under Defensive Line - played as set. Under Defensive Tackle - played as set. Under Defensive End - played based on ratings not by settings. Defensive End setting is broken.
2/26/2013 12:14 PM
Found it.  It was the same issue as we were having on the offensive depth charts but I thought the change I made affected both.  I'll try to get that updated soon.
2/26/2013 1:01 PM
I converted a TE to RB, put him #1 in all RB depth charts. When running a test game, this player does not participate in the game.
2/26/2013 2:17 PM
What happens if  the depth chart for OT and OG/C are the same? What determines which OL are used at OT opposed to OG/C? Reason i ask is in the current engine players can only be listed in one drop down (i.e. if a player is listed as OLB, he can't be in the ILB list also).  And sorry in advance if this has been covered. I rarely read the forums but instead try to figure it out on my own as best as i can.
2/26/2013 4:22 PM
Posted by tarrin on 2/26/2013 2:17:00 PM (view original):
What happens if  the depth chart for OT and OG/C are the same? What determines which OL are used at OT opposed to OG/C? Reason i ask is in the current engine players can only be listed in one drop down (i.e. if a player is listed as OLB, he can't be in the ILB list also).  And sorry in advance if this has been covered. I rarely read the forums but instead try to figure it out on my own as best as i can.
The formations are displayed in slot order and this is important in understanding how players are pulled into play for each slot.  There are a few differences between 3.0 and 2.0 that will take some time to get used to.  On difference is as you noted that players can be in multiple depth charts.

This is the flow in how it fills each slot, for each step checking slot 1-11:
1. fill with player from corresponding depth chart - check rest level (see below)
2. fill with remainder of players from depth chart - check rest level
3. fill with players from depth chart - allow players below rest level
4. fill with players from default depth chart (e.g plain "QB" depth chart instead of "QB Rush") - check rest level
5. fill with players from default depth chart - allow players below rest level
6. fill with any players from position that are not in depth chart - check rest level
7. fill with any players from position that are not in depth chart - allow below rest level
8. fill with players from other positions - allow below rest level

Chances are the check does not have to go through all of these steps and by the time you get to where you are playing a player out of position, it has exhausted it's options for players at that position.

One key concept in this is that it checks each of these steps moving through slot 1 through slot 11, and then repeating for the next step.  What this does is it helps in trying to get the players to their most optimal slot based on your depth charts.

The first step in this is kind of unique in that it will skip a slot and move to the next player if the player specifically lined up with that slot is not available (already used or resting) and this is to help keep the starters in consistent spots.  So let's take the example of 3 LBs in 3 LB slots.  If they all pull fro the same LB depth chart, they will be filled in order:

LB Depth Chart
1. Abercrombie
2. Bertrand
3. Cronkite
4. Davidson
5. Earle
6. Franklin

If all players are fully rested, the LB slots will be filled as such:

Slot 1: Abercrombie
Slot 2: Bertrand
Slot 3: Cronkite

Now, let's say Abercrombie reaches his rest level:

Slot 1: Davidson
Slot 2: Bertrand
Slot 3: Cronkite

As you can see, it preserved the starters in their usual spots and brought the sub in for the resting player.  In 2.0, you would have seen these players all shift up 1 spot.  There are some cases where you would see Abercrombie come in at a different slot because he is skipped because he needs rest but for a later check we need him on the field ignoring his rest.  This can be confusing and I'd like to find a way to say if Abercrombie comes on the field he should be in his usual starting spot, but that kind of logic will take some extra care and I'd like to get feedback before spending time on it.
2/26/2013 4:34 PM
To answer the question of how it fills in players from OT and OG/C if they are set the same is that it gets a bit complicated because of the above.  It will try to fill in the corresponding player in the list and then fill in the gaps, so it might be difficult to follow.  So typically the OL slots would be set to depth charts as such:

Slot1: OT
Slot2: OG/C
Slot3: OG/C
Slot4: OG/C
Slot5: OT

If the above example was a list of OL, set in that order for both OT and OG/C depth charts, the slots would be filled as such, assuming no player needs rest:

Slot 1: Abercrombie (OT 1)
Slot 2: (Abercrombie OG/C 1 already used)
Slot 3: Bertrand (OG/C 2)
Slot 4: Cronkite (OG/C 3)
Slot 5: (Bertrand OT 2 already used)

Step 2:

Slot 1: Abercrombie (OT 1)
Slot 2: Davidson (OG/C 4) - since OG/C 1-3 are already used
Slot 3: Bertrand (OG/C 2)
Slot 4: Cronkite (OG/C 3)
Slot 5: Earle (OT 5) - since OT 1-4 are already used

For this reason, if you really just have every depth chart the same, it might be best to just use the OL depth chart in this case.  You will get more consistent, predictable starts and subs that way.  If you truly have a difference in personnel for the different roles, then using the different role depth charts are the way to go.

2/26/2013 4:36 PM
if anyone sees subs being handled differently than this, please let me know.  Note: there is a bug with identifying formation settings on defense right now that is pulling from the wrong depth charts, so ignore defensive starter/subs for now.
2/26/2013 6:41 PM
What is the advantage to jumping the slot and leaving it empty (in this case, slot 2) rather than fill Slot 2 with Bertrand (the first available guy in the OG/C list).
2/26/2013 10:50 PM
Tried the DL line-ups and it works. Thanks Norbert.
2/27/2013 12:59 AM
I may be overlooking something, but it seems like if you use the suggested position numbers, and set the depth chart accordingly, it may not be universal.  For instance, in the 4-3, num 3 db is a safety.  However, if you run the nickel, number 3 db is a cornerback. So number 3 is just the 3rd db on the depth chart right?  Is there something I am missing?  Thanks in advance for any info.  I am still a bit confused without the seperate depth charts for safeties and cbs, and trying to figure out how it works. 
2/27/2013 9:01 AM
Posted by samson75 on 2/27/2013 1:00:00 AM (view original):
I may be overlooking something, but it seems like if you use the suggested position numbers, and set the depth chart accordingly, it may not be universal.  For instance, in the 4-3, num 3 db is a safety.  However, if you run the nickel, number 3 db is a cornerback. So number 3 is just the 3rd db on the depth chart right?  Is there something I am missing?  Thanks in advance for any info.  I am still a bit confused without the seperate depth charts for safeties and cbs, and trying to figure out how it works. 
If you look at the Formation, it will tell you the slot name inside the trapezoid ...

So for Default nickel, DB1, DB2, and DB3 are CBs and DB4 and DB5 are Safeties.

You pick the player role that plays there (if you are using the advanced settings) by using the dropdown box. If all of them are set to Defensive Back, then yes, it would be the 3rd player listed in the Defensive Back role who plays DB3.

If you assign Cornerback to DB1, DB2, and DB3 and Safety to DB4 and DB5 .. then the top 3 players from the Cornerback Role fill DB1, DB2, and DB3 and the top 2 from the Safety Role fill DB4 and DB5.
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