Koufax vs. Kaat Game 7 of 1965 World Series Topic



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeKbktNm0Mk
3/3/2015 6:41 AM
I watchd this game last night. A few things stand out in my mind:

First, this was Koufax on two days' rest (Kaat too) and on an off-day - no curveball, pitches up, and he pitches a 4-hit shutout.

Second, a few players were more impressive than I thought they would be: 

Harmon Killebrew fields reasonably well, not a great 3B but he is not a defensive liability. I had always assumed that he should have been at first base but the Twins were stuck with him at third or something. But he can play the position.

Wes Parker was better than I thought - I always thought of him as a weak hitting 1B, but his speed is truly impressive on that triple. 

Zoilo Versalles really seems the kind of player who could take over a game. He hit into bad luck a couple of times in this game but it was a joy to see him play, don't think I ever had before, though I recall having had his baseball card in circa 1969 and thinking "who?".

Tony Oliva could also field well. 

I had literally never heard of Lou Johnson and had to look him up. The clean up hitter for the World Champions hit 12 home runs in 1965. 12. Killebrew, a major power hitter did miss 7 weeks of the 1965 season and ended up with 25 homers, so was on pace for maybe 40. 40. Not 73. not 66. 40. 

Vin Scully is a great announcer. You see that because when he takes over the play by play in the 5th, we go from a literal description to what is happening on the field to all sorts of dimensions of the game: Koufax has no curve and isn't throwing the change either, the Twins for some reason are swinging at the first pitch despite Koufax being visibly exhausted by the 7th and pitching on two days rest, Gilliam's grab may have saved the World Series and so on. 

And finally, of course, to paraphrase the announcers, "This has been a conflict-free World Series, no real arguments so far. Here comes Billy Martin..."
3/4/2015 2:40 AM
I started collecting cards in 1969 and still have them. Recall getting the Versalles card; he looked old and angry and, of course, I had never heard of him before. Believe he was on the Padres by then. Back of card indicated he was an MVP. Didn't know who to pronounce his name for years.
3/4/2015 4:22 PM
it is such a tragedy that they overused Koufax the way they did in his great years...he was just in his prime when he had to retire..can you imagine his career if had more great years through 1974 or so....ould have had 10 cy youngs...would have had 300 plus wins...could have had a 1.0 or lower era in 1968... would have.vied against carlton for cy young 1n 72.. and probably would have ended his career like satchel paige in the bullpen..etc etc...
3/4/2015 11:18 PM
Yes. And while it was game 7, they had Drysdale rested - not Joe Schmoe, Don Drysdale, with Koufax in the bullpen if needed, as the Diamondbacks used Randy Johnson in 2001. 

Constantly 300 plus innings, for a staff that had people like Drysdale, Sutton, Downing, Osteen - so it wasn't like the Dodgers had no chance without Koufax on the mound. 
3/5/2015 6:00 AM
Koufax only pitched 300 + innings thrice. He was a bonus baby and it took him awhile to hit his stride (was very wild. while he always had a low OAV, his walks were difficult to absorb). He only pitched one year with a rookie Sutton. I agree it was too bad he ended up with a sore arm, but if he had hit his stride 3 years earlier he would have still put up an even better career.
3/5/2015 1:15 PM
as the father of a college catcher what struck me was how much more demanding the job of being a receiver is today. Roseboro was clearly one of the top defensive catchers of his day but with that technique he wouldn't have a roster spot today.
3/11/2015 8:57 PM
Thanks for posting the link. Some observations:

Did you notice how the batters generally stayed in the batters box, and the game seemed to move along?

In the 1st or 2nd inning, a ball was fouled into the stands and the umpire throws a new ball to Koufax. Before a pitch is made he gets the ball back and inspects it. In the 6th inning Koufax throws a pitch in the dirt and Rosboro picks it up and returns it to Koufax. The umpire doesn't replace it. Later a Twin hits a foul ball down in the ground on the 3rd base side. Billy Martin (3rd base coach) picks up the ball and returns the ball to Koufax. Again no umpire intervention to replace it.

As for the choice of Koufax over Drysdale, much is made today of Him going on 2 days rest. He normally pitched on 3 days rest and 2 days was not unheard of. Its the last game of the season and they were set up better for in game decisions with a left, right, left versus a right , left, left plan. Koufax was always a sore armed pitcher. Even though he wasn't at the top of his game, I thought he pitched better the last 2 innings than the 1st two. The mound was higher then than now, which is less stressful on the arm. I believe most of the modern day arm troubles stem from the lowering of the mound and the multiple variety of pitches and delivery points employed by pitchers today.

In the '60s the American League was a fast ball league. AL umpires called a higher strike than the NL The AL played In mostly older, smaller ball parks, all of which lent itself to playing station to station baseball and relying on the long ball. The NL had pitchers with more stuff...Koufax, Gibson, Drysdale, Marichal and many others. Put them in those bigger multi-purpose stadiums, many with artificial turf, and that led to playing "small" ball. The main reason why the DH was added by the AL, was because they were losing to the NL in attendance and wanted to add some offense to their game, which was suffering.

The Twins were probably 1st pitch swinging at the beginning of the game because the were a fast ball hitting club and figured to get fast balls early in the count. Koufax's out pitch was considered to be an unhittable curve when he was on. His legend stood him in good stead.

Lou Johnson was nick named Sweet Lou. His attitude seemed to throw an upbeat light on the whole team. He was the replacement for Tommy Davis, who broke his ankle sliding into 2nd the 17th game of the season. Angelenos thought the season ended there, so he was a very happy surprise. Lou's presence contributed as much as anybody to the success of the season and was a feel good story for MLB. He's still involved in the Dodger Organization in many PR events.
3/18/2015 3:15 AM (edited)
Also, comment was made about Wes Parker and his speed. Wes Parker would probably have been the Dodgers center fielder if they didn't already have Willy Davis. He Played a lot of center when he first came up. Many of the Dodgers of that time were proficient at multiple positions, which was not as common then as now. They had a lot of switch hitters including pitchers on that '65 squad. All four starting infielders were switch hitters.
3/18/2015 3:30 AM
Drawdexer, thanks so much for really informative and insightful comments. Good point about the mound height being a major cause of arm troubles today. The problem is that they could have raised it to even the playing field in the steroid era, but now their worry is about how little offense there is in the past few years. 

The Dodgers are an interesting team in that era because of the switch-hitting, speed, versatility of players. This could be a good approach to dealing with the expenses of player contracts today, versatile players allowing for covering a lot of ground (literally and figuratively). 


3/18/2015 4:43 AM
Great info and conversation. Also enjoyed the entire postgame interview between Koufax and Vin Scully, though most especially:

[After game 5] "You were quoted as saying you felt 100 years old. So today, how do you feel?" "101."
3/19/2015 5:13 PM
Koufax vs. Kaat Game 7 of 1965 World Series Topic

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