Great trivia question Topic

Who is the only league MVP that never made an all-star game his entire career?
4/21/2014 2:55 PM
Kirk Gibson
4/21/2014 3:35 PM
Kirk Gibson
4/21/2014 3:35 PM
My first thought was Zoilo Versalles, but it looks like he made two all-star teams
4/21/2014 3:41 PM
Gibby is correct further proving he was a terrible MVP selection in 1988.  Teammate Orel Hershiser should've been MVP that year!
4/21/2014 4:55 PM
I would have a very hard time saying Gibson was a "terrible MVP selection."  He was easily a top 3 offensive player in 1988 by any honest evaluation.  There have been some horrible MVP winners.  This was not one of them.  There really was no obvious MVP candidate in the NL in '88.  I'm honestly surprised Galarraga didn't do much better based on the general MVP voting trends in the '80s and early '90s, but Gibson wasn't a bad choice.
4/23/2014 5:04 PM
I don't mind pitchers winning the occasional MVP even though they do have their own awards, but I do think they need to have truly exceptional seasons to deserve to win the biggest award traditionally reserved for offensive players.  And while he had an exceptional run to close out the season, on balance he wasn't really a singularly dominant pitcher in 1988.  He was 3rd in the league in ERA.  His strikeout total was thoroughly unexceptional at best.  The 59-inning streak to close the season made him a unanimous Cy Young winner, but without that he was probably only a narrow favorite to win.  In fact, before the streak he probably wouldn't have been a top 3 candidate (his ERA was over 3 in mid-August, in a season in which 16 National League pitchers had ERA's of 3.00 or better).

That doesn't reek of MVP-caliber pitcher to me.  So you pick the best of the bats.  Which is like a 4- or 5-way toss-up, effectively.
4/23/2014 5:13 PM
A lot of met fans felt that Kevin mc Reynolds took votes away from Strawberry.

looking back in baseball reference  Strawberry had an OPS over 900,  Hershiser had the highest War (First time I used War ever) 

So the MVP should have been   Andy Van Slyke
4/23/2014 8:39 PM
I was a big fan of Gibson's so I was surprised to learn he'd never made it to an all star game.  A quick Google search however reveals that he was twice selected to play (in '85 and '88) but declined both times.  Could be he had nagging injuries (he had those a lot) or he was the type of player who didn't care for meaningless exhibition games.  

In either event, it's a bit misleading to say he never "made" an all star game.  He never played in one, but he was twice invited to play.
4/23/2014 8:50 PM
I think Strawberry was probably the true "MVP" in 1988 with a very good Mets team. His .269 BA held him back and as mentioned above, McReynolds probably took some of his votes away (BTW, I've used the '88 McReynolds in SIM several times.   Decent fielding, excellent OPS+ and a 21-0 sb/cs line).   All in all, Gibby wasn't a bad choice. He seemingly scored every time he was on base, but he didn't drive in many runs given 25 circuit clouts (I know both his runs scored and RBI are dependent on his teammate's performance, but gee whiz, 76 RBI w/ 25 homers batting in the middle of the lineup "ain't great").   I guess if I had a hindsight vote, I'd go
Strawberry, Galarraga, Van Slyke, Gibby, and Will Clark in that order.  
4/24/2014 7:34 PM
Orel Hershiser (Dodgers pitcher 1983-94, now ESPN analyst): The first game of spring training, Jesse Orosco put eye black inside the edge of Kirk's hat before Kirk went out to run his sprints before that game. The team and the crowd at Vero Beach laughed at Kirk because he had black streaks across his forehead when he took his hat off to run. He didn't take it very well.

Gibson: I thought I took it great.

Hershiser: He was so mad that he walked off the field and didn't play in that first game. We had a team meeting the next day, and he expressed his desire to play on a team that took the game seriously. Fun is fun, but, when it's game time, you don't mess with other people on your team and you do everything you can to win the game even if it's spring training. I think it was a significant moment.


That wasn't entirely the truth - basically, he went off on every one of the players in language not allowed on this site, saying that that's why they sucked last year.  He stormed off the field, he didn't walk.  

Forget his numbers, he willed that team to win like no one before him.
4/25/2014 6:08 PM
I'm always skeptical of "he willed that team to win" arguments....which strike me as after-the-fact justifications cherry-picked to fit the narrative.  You can always find a story like that on any team that won.  And you could always find a story like that on any team that didn't win.  No one remembers the hundreds of motivational actions/speeches/attitudes that happened on the thousands of teams that didn't win.

If Gibson had some kind of magical characteristic that "didn't show up in the stats" it was curiously absent most of his career.  It is also interesting that Gibby played on a team (the early-mid 80s Tigers) that has to be considered one of the most underachieving clubs in history.  They should have dominated the AL East during Gibson's tenure - no other club had their talent top-to-bottom - but they did not.

4/25/2014 6:17 PM
contrarian23, I share youy skepticism on the motivational stuff, but I can't agree that the early-mid '80s Tigers were an "underachieving" club.  In my opinion they had above average talent, had the one great season in '84, made the playoffs again in '87 (Gibson's last season before moving on to LA), and were otherwise a decent .500+ team until 1989 when they started aging and losing their talent through free agency.  Consider that no player on the '80s Tigers is in the Hall of Fame, while their American League rivals had the following playing at or near their peaks in the 1980s:

Brett, Henderson, Ripken, Murray, Yount, Molitor, Winfield, Boggs, Blyleven, Rice, Puckett (all in the HOF) plus Mattingly, Guidry, Stieb, Saberhagen, Clemens and Dwight Evans.

(Most of the above played in the AL East, too.)

I've honestly never heard of the '80s Tigers referred to as an underachieving team.  I also assumed most people thought of the '84 team as overachievers...
4/26/2014 1:53 PM (edited)
I would say that Rick Dempsey and Mickey hatcher were just as motivational as gibson.

4/26/2014 8:13 PM
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