7/30/2013 11:50 AM
We have so many beta testers, and its not like everyone is running autopilot and abandoned. Why is it only a dozen or so people post about the beta? 
7/30/2013 12:30 PM
My guess:
1.  The same reasons 2.0 is empty
2.  Nobody knows what the developers are working on or what they want feedback on
7/30/2013 12:45 PM
The forum community has always been small relative to the number of active players. I'm guessing many of them don't come to the forums anyways, and the ones that do are facing the issues Reid mentioned. 
7/30/2013 12:52 PM
I have those same problems, I still comment on it to try to involve myself. It is my belief if everyone contributed even in random ways, that it would be more to go off of and better for the game. Tho I do know (because I have old alt's that have teams) that the numbers are exaggerated by alt's. that, and if you don't currently have anything running that you bought (or used rewards for) then you don't get to post. (Which I would propose if possible to make an exception for this forum) 
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7/30/2013 8:12 PM
most of them dont play 2.0
7/30/2013 9:34 PM
Posted by slid64er on 7/30/2013 12:30:00 PM (view original):
My guess:
1.  The same reasons 2.0 is empty
2.  Nobody knows what the developers are working on or what they want feedback on
Your second point is a very good one. A little transparency would go a long way toward bringing a community together with the expectations of WIS/FOX for the future of this thing.

From their perspective, I would say that there is a fairly low signal to noise ratio here. It's difficult to know what they should actually pay attention to. It's also difficult to know what they have already paid attention to so we can all move on to testing some other aspect and/or quit complaining about something that is being actively developed.

For instance, TE passing was thought to be fixed in a release but that turned out to be incorrect. What we don't know since is if it's still being worked on, and that's something that WIS will have to facilitate.

I guess my point is that if Oriole or any other dev want to continue to have us test their system for free, then they should try to communicate more with the community so we can do more to *help* and get less frustrated with the percieved lack of progress.
7/30/2013 11:36 PM
Basically IMHO 2.0 sucks but with the potential this game has, I'm holding out that 3.0 will work.  I agree with most of the posts that keep popping up (talent should be king, were are the TEs, etc.)  I agree with starfinder77 also in that there shouldn't be two versions (basic/adv.) it should be advanced or nothing.  Otherwise just keep 2.0 and flip a coin each half. 

This is of course a new account but I started season 2 in Wilkinson.  Played 1.0 till I got bored then came back 4 seasons ago and was amazed by how bad this game got.  I was hoping for some improvement (again lots of potential in this game).  Most don't post due to lack of any feedback from WIS.
7/31/2013 3:00 AM
Part of beta testing is knowing the baseline and knowing the deltas in the code, and testing for the results of the changes. Who knows what they are doing? I don't. So I am keeping two teams afloat for the day that something worthwhile to do is presented.
7/31/2013 11:38 PM
Posted by noah23 on 7/30/2013 11:50:00 AM (view original):
We have so many beta testers, and its not like everyone is running autopilot and abandoned. Why is it only a dozen or so people post about the beta? 
IMO, it is almost pointless to post about the beta.  I read the forum daily, and there are a ton of great suggestions and problems that are pointed out which appear to fall on deaf ears.  The current state of this engine makes it a "set it" and "forget it" game.  It seems like the updates are fluff. I have changed my GP one-time since the season started; I switched my formations from Trips to Pro-Set to see what would happen.  Result= similar results
8/1/2013 1:28 AM
Posted by jhard70 on 7/31/2013 11:38:00 PM (view original):
Posted by noah23 on 7/30/2013 11:50:00 AM (view original):
We have so many beta testers, and its not like everyone is running autopilot and abandoned. Why is it only a dozen or so people post about the beta? 
IMO, it is almost pointless to post about the beta.  I read the forum daily, and there are a ton of great suggestions and problems that are pointed out which appear to fall on deaf ears.  The current state of this engine makes it a "set it" and "forget it" game.  It seems like the updates are fluff. I have changed my GP one-time since the season started; I switched my formations from Trips to Pro-Set to see what would happen.  Result= similar results
That is one of the reasons why I get so confused about people saying its time consuming. The differences in sets are very slight, and you don't have to change anything all the time. Find what your team is good at and you can set it up. only reason to change up is if the other team has a stellar set of db's or lineman or something. (which its notable that I haven't changed my gameplan in 2.0 more then once in a season since I've started the bridgewater team.)
8/1/2013 7:38 AM
my problem is i have to open chrome every time i want to post.  I use IE as my default.  So most of the time just read instead of opening this up.
8/1/2013 11:33 AM (edited)
current work: I'm working on getting the passing statistics to line up with expectations/reality. Most of these changes are structural. 
work this week: Tight End, and historical significance (I'll explain a bit about that in a bit) 

Your ideas are not falling on deaf ears, just quiet mouths. The notes brought up are always paramount to the decisions I'm making in the engine. Sometimes the view of each of the comments contradict, but I do my best to sort through them and come up with an answer that meshes as much as it can. 

If you really want to know what I'm working on right now: when I took over the game I noticed that it is in an unsustainable configuration. It's difficult to maintain, it's difficult to test (for me and you) and it's difficult to understand. NOT that I don't understand it, just that the state of the code is a bit convoluted and it's hard to dig down to the desired numbers for the desired situations. This takes way longer than it should for anyone to investigate easy problems. I'm fixing that. Unfortunately this is coming at a time when I have you guys beta testing for me, so the changes aren't as glamorous as you or I would like, but the base is being rebuilt to a point of sustainability and reliability. bla bla bla, right? I know we were hoping to have a completed game before this, but at this point we are not there yet. I'm putting in extra time to get the structure of the game to be reliable enough to be able to unit test the hell of out this thing.  I'm tweaking the numbers along the way to better suit the needs of the players and the ease of use, but right now things are not perfect. I believe the numbers are close, but the minor changes that need to be made are way more difficult in the previous structure of the code. 

So, while my job right now is not glamorous, neither is yours. I need you guys to play the game and find out what was working before and is not working now. Right now it doesn't have to be the numbers so much (but if you see weird numbers I'm taking notes on all that too.) but stuff like "Starters are broken" and "Tight ends are broken" are super helpful right now. I fixed the starter issue, and I'm looking into TE's this week.

8/1/2013 10:08 AM
So, while my job right now is not glamorous, neither is yours. I need you guys to play the game and find out what was working before and is not working now. Right now it doesn't have to be the numbers so much (but if you see weird numbers I'm taking notes on all that too.) but stuff like "Starters are broken" and "Tight ends are broken" are super helpful right now. I fixed the starter issue, and I'm looking into TE's this week.

Thank you for the information, Oriole. While fixing infrastructure is not glamorous, I understand it's necessity. I think if you increase the frequency of your communication it will decrease the angst of the beta players and result in a higher signal to noise ratio.

-s

8/1/2013 10:13 AM
+1 on use of signal to noise ratio!

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