All Forums > Hoops Dynasty Basketball > Hoops Dynasty > I will miss Old Warrior/Iguana
5/24/2013 3:21 PM
Posted by hughesjr on 5/24/2013 2:38:00 PM (view original):
Posted by ll316 on 5/23/2013 11:40:00 PM (view original):
Posted by hughesjr on 5/23/2013 3:13:00 PM (view original):
Posted by emy1013 on 5/23/2013 1:05:00 AM (view original):
Posted by hughesjr on 5/22/2013 9:56:00 PM (view original):
If they are going to have a rule they need to enforce it.

If they don't want to enforce it then abolish the rule.

I am sorry to see someone quit, but rules are rules and they should be enforced ... consistently.

I don't expect WIS to spend their days LOOKING for people who are within 1000 miles ... but if they are informed of the situation then I do think they need to address it.
And what of the people that had two teams in accordance with the rules in place, only to have those rules changed later.  Initially, coaches WERE abiding by the rules in place at that time.  The rules then changed, making those teams now not in accordance with the the rules.  How is this the coach's fault when he WAS within the rules initially?

I gave up a pretty damn good team in Tark recently just to get far enough away to keep my D2 team, the first D2 team I ever had.  I've had teams under both of those ID's since the second season in that world (going on close to eight calendar years, I'd say.  Maybe seven, I can't remember).  The rules back then said that a coach couldn't have two teams in the same CONFERENCE, NOTHING about same division or any certain mileage apart.  Nothing.  I moved voluntarily this offseason, just so I wouldn't have to hear someone whining about my situation, but I'll tell you, it still sucks.  And to answer before some smartass asks, I have two teams in that world because at the time it was the ONLY two-a-day world and I happen to like the faster paced game.  By the time the next turbo world opened, I had many seasons invested in those two teams and had no desire to flush all that time and money down the toilet.  So sue me.
Well then, they should follow the rules NOW ... or they should quit.

The rules are the rules ... follow them. We don't need to follow the rules from 5 years ago or the ones that will be in place five years from now ... we need to follow the rules for now. This is a game, it has rules, they need to be followed.

At any level except Div-1, you should be able to take any team and turn them into a perennial contender in 4-5 seasons maximum. By contender, I mean top 25 rating.

There are some places, like Alaska, Hawaii or the Puerto Rico schools where it might be difficult to get them up to that level ... but just about any other Div-2 or Div-3 school should be doable in less than 5 seasons.
What does being able to be good again have to do with anything?  Well for one, that's 4-5 seasons worth of money down the drain when you've already spent years (literally in some cases) building up a program. But the cost for many is more than the money.  The time spent building a "Dynasty" that's the real cost.  Now, looking at your history Hughs, I can see that's of no value to you.  some people like to bounce around.  To each their own.  But that doesn't mean it's not value lost for others.

Edit:  I should have read all the way down.  Tarvalon covered everything I said.
Well ... I'm sorry but violating the fair play guidelines is cheating (else, why have fair play guidelines in the first place)... it is against the f!@#ing rules.  If you are going to let anyone do it then you have to let everyone do it.

If you can't play a game by the rules then you should be banned.

Why have rules if you are not going to enforce them?

Want to know why you just lost credibility?  Because you think cheating and breaking the rules are interchangable.  Cheating is to act dishonestly in order to gain an advantage.  Breaking the rules is breaking the rules.
5/24/2013 3:39 PM
So clearly the pressing question is what happens in this imaginary land if the 2 kids are conjoined twins?
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5/24/2013 4:26 PM
Posted by stinenavy on 5/24/2013 3:57:00 PM (view original):
No idea why emy wasted his time with that second paragraph. Just an embarrassingly stupid post.

When you were in the military did you get to pick and choose what rules you were going to follow?
If you can't follow that second paragraph then there really is no point trying to explain it to you.  Answer me this Mr. Navy, do you REALLY think the military enforces ALL the rules on the books?  Really?  My guess is you're calling it "embarrassingly stupid" because you now see the error of Seble's ways.  Easy to just call it stupid and dismiss it without actually addressing the points made.

The point that you can't seem to grasp, Einstein, is that those coaches WERE FOLLOWING THE RULES IN PLACE.  How hard is that to understand?  My kid is eight and he could grasp that concept, so how come it's so hard for you and a few others to understand?

And yes Ike, I guess to a certain limited few the world does operate in black and white.  Probably the same few that think the earth is still flat.
5/24/2013 4:36 PM
Posted by stinenavy on 5/24/2013 3:48:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tarvolon on 5/24/2013 2:37:00 PM (view original):
Posted by stinenavy on 5/24/2013 12:50:00 PM (view original):
I skimmed through the thread where the fair play guidelines were discussed.

www.whatifsports.com/forums/Posts.aspx

I saw no mention of anyone having an issue with the 1000 mile rule. Numerous people ignored the rule, and now that some people are being reported as cheaters this is apparently the worst thing ever.

This should've been taken care of when the rule was instituted. When you put the rule on the books, either grandfather people in or enforce it immediately (and provide some compensation, as I argued earlier). If you're going to do neither of those things, people are going to complain about inconsistency. 
Or people could adhere by the rules when they were put in place, instead of hoping to keep breaking the rules.
As I stated earlier, those coaches WERE ADHERING TO THE RULES IN PLACE WHEN THEY GOT A SECOND TEAM, not their fault the rug got yanked out from under them.  Why is that so difficult for you geniuses to understand?  Since you can't quite seem to grasp the concept, I'll type this r...e...a...l s..l..o..w.  The rules in place when Tark opened (since that's the world where the shitstorm started) said that a coach couldn't have two teams in the same conference.  That's it.  That was the only thing that was prohibited.  So.......since several people liked the faster pace of the two-a-day world, they picked up a second team (see Knight and Phelan worlds didn't exist yet, and wouldn't for quite awhile, so only ONE choice for a turbo world).  Once again, with that second team, the ONLY thing that was prohibited was having both of your teams in the same conference.  Nothing else.  Nada.  Zip.  Zilch.  Same division didn't matter, having a second team 3 miles down the road from the first didn't matter.  The original Admin (you know, only the guy who CREATED the damn game) said so himself.

So to answer your statement above, again, people WERE adhering to the rules in place.  Not that difficult to comprehend I would think, but obviously for some people it is.
5/24/2013 4:39 PM
Interesting thread.

For the record, I support the grandfathering of folks that had teams prior to the 1000 mile rule.

And for the record, I think that Iguana was one of the more helpful and intelligent users in HD.  Losing him will be a loss.  His forum posts were gold.


And with those disclaimers out of the way, Iguana / Oldwarrior is a perfect example for those that are anti-grandfathering and/or opposed to two teams in the same world.  This is a year old thread, but I still remember it because I lost a tremendous amount of respect for Iguana after reading it.  Iguana took his Michigan State team and recruited a player from the South that was previously considering a different team in his D2 conference.  Yes, it is possible that Iguana did that with "blinders on" and chose to scout and recruit a long distance state that just happened to be in the 360 mile radius of his D2 team and since the blinders were on didn't notice that he'd be taking a recruit from another team in his D2 conference which would obviously benefit the D2 team.  But there is just way too much opportunity for foul play in what happened and as such it impacted the way I looked at Iguana.  And as such I think it is rather amusing that he's being held as a paragon of something that WIS needs to go out of its way to protect.

5/25/2013 12:40 PM (edited)
Posted by killbatman on 5/24/2013 3:39:00 PM (view original):
So clearly the pressing question is what happens in this imaginary land if the 2 kids are conjoined twins?

Well that would obviously be collusion!

5/24/2013 4:47 PM
You didn't answer my question.

No, not all military rules are enforced, but they all should be. It's that simple. I think the error is that the rules should be more stringent and you should only have one username per world.

If you routinely drive 60 in a 35 MPH zone because there's never anyone that enforces the speed limit, and then you receive a ticket will you whine about it because it wasn't enforced before? How far do you think that will get you?

Where was your outrage when the fairplay guidelines were first updated about a year ago?
5/24/2013 5:24 PM
Posted by stinenavy on 5/24/2013 4:47:00 PM (view original):
You didn't answer my question.

No, not all military rules are enforced, but they all should be. It's that simple. I think the error is that the rules should be more stringent and you should only have one username per world.

If you routinely drive 60 in a 35 MPH zone because there's never anyone that enforces the speed limit, and then you receive a ticket will you whine about it because it wasn't enforced before? How far do you think that will get you?

Where was your outrage when the fairplay guidelines were first updated about a year ago?
Now you're just trying to be stubborn to get an argument going.  All the military rules should be enforced?  Really?  You obviously have no idea how many rules and laws are in the UCMJ because if you did you wouldn't be making such an asinine statement.  You realize should check out the UCMJ and look at it carefully before you decide that all the rules and regulations should be enforced.  Ever cursed Stine?  Well, guess what, you just broke general Article 134 of the UCMJ.  Ever failed to follow procedural rules, down to the last letter (you know, taking a short cut here or there, and you know you have, everyone has)?  Guilty again.  Ever caused loss, damage, destruction, or wrongful disposition of government property (and you know you've broken something during your Navy days or thrown something away that was still of use)?  Again, guilty as charged.

So, do you REALLY want ALL of the laws of the UCMJ enforced?  Because if you do, then EVERY person in every branch of the military would have a charge on their record.  You want to get stupid and say that all the rules should be enforced, well there it is, you've now got everyone (to include yourself) charged under the UCMJ.  To quote you, "it's that simple".  Have a good day and good luck getting a job with that dishonorable discharge on your record, thanks to you wanting ALL the military rules enforced (unless of course, you see how enforcing ALL the rules like you wished, would be a bad idea after all).  And before you say I'm nitpicking, it was YOU who said that they ALL should be enforced.

Oh, and who says I WASN'T outraged a year ago when the guidelines were updated?  You have no idea, NONE, of the tickets I've sent, or of the conversations with CS I've had regarding that matter.  Just because I didn't post anything in the forums then didn't mean I wasn't "outraged".  I'll remember next time to run everything by you first, before I submit a ticket or anything else, so you can take note of how "outraged" I am about an issue.  The reason I am posting now is because it has become a huge issue on the forums so this is where I feel like I need to express my opinions.

But enough about this for me.  As I said in another thread, I voluntarily moved my D1 team far more than 1000 miles away from my D2 team, a move that I took the initiative to make to avoid getting told on by people who want to act like junior high hall monitors. 
5/24/2013 5:32 PM
Stinenavy--a rather flawed analogy.  How about a real life analogy?  Years ago, it was OK for a District of Columbia cop to live in suburban Maryland--where there was more affordable housing, better schools, safer neighborhoods, etc.  Large amounts of people joined the DC force when it was OK to live in Md, so they did.  Then the DC Council decided, well, DC cops should live in DC.  Instead of grandfathering in the ones that had joined when it was OK, they said, move to DC or lose your job.  Now, they had their addresses on record, so enforcement was no problem.  But suppose they didn't, and they depended on fellow officers to rat them out?  These cops had joined the DC force when it was OK to live in Md; the new regs were not being enforced unless someone ratted out a fellow officer.  Is that really any different from what happened in HD?   HD depends on people to rat out their fellow coaches.  Just great!    So go ahead, be sanctimonious if you wish.
TL 
5/24/2013 6:36 PM
Flawed? There's no instances of an area in which the police didn't enforce a speed limit, suddenly enforce the speed limit by giving out tickets?

Emy, feel free to post your tickets from when the 1000 mile rule took effect, and great to here you knowingly were breaking the 1000 mile rule for almost a year. How honorable of you. At least billy_g claimed ignorance.
5/24/2013 6:52 PM
This thread, and some people in it, are McCarthy-esque. 
5/24/2013 7:33 PM (edited)
Posted by stinenavy on 5/24/2013 6:36:00 PM (view original):
Flawed? There's no instances of an area in which the police didn't enforce a speed limit, suddenly enforce the speed limit by giving out tickets?

Emy, feel free to post your tickets from when the 1000 mile rule took effect, and great to here you knowingly were breaking the 1000 mile rule for almost a year. How honorable of you. At least billy_g claimed ignorance.
the example is totally different, because you have to ACTIVELY break the speed limit each time you drive. when you have a team, and the rule is changed, you PASSIVELY are breaking the rule - you didnt actually DO anything to break the rule, and its not even like failing to register for the draft when you turn 18, because you were following the rules and they changed, not like someone is breaking a long standing very clear rule by doing nothing.

id say its a third level removed even. sometimes right before holidays when 600 reps have gone home, the few remaining congressmen pass random **** they probably couldnt get away with in a full session. is it still the law? yes, but its kind of bullshit because the law making process was bullshit. when seble, who doesnt even really play the game, makes a rule merely to silence a few whiners, in an area where enforcement and communication have been consistently *terrible*... i dont get the feeling this rule was put into place for good reasons or with truly good and thought out intentions. so you have a hard to respect rule, that isnt being actively broken, by someone who always followed the rules up until the change. and you think thats a valid comparison to day after day, breaking the law by going 60 in a 35, and then being ****** when you get caught? how is it even close?
5/24/2013 7:24 PM (edited)

a good comparison would be if the 1994 assault weapon ban made you turn in your guns, like they did in australia, and you had one before the rule, always followed the rule, and were a firm believer in your constitutional rights. i strongly suspect if that 94 ban forced turnins, we'd have millions of law breakers who fit that bill, but would you really be all over their ****? i wouldnt. what if the law said you couldnt own the guns but gave no hints on how to go about getting rid of it, no turn in program, no destruction program, no direction at all. what then? i would think 99% of people would ignore the rule, just like the people with multiple teams in-place when the rule changed. you cant tell people something is not allowed and give no direction on how to reconcile the situation. and if you are going to make people give up something they really care about, you owe them the respect of really thinking things out, and i cant believe that happened here. plus the whole category of issues was basically ignored by admin forever, so you have to add the facade of the government psuedo randomly changing the gun laws for 20 years leading up to 1994, and never really enforced any of them, to really get a good comparison.

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