All Forums > Hoops Dynasty Basketball > Hoops Dynasty > My time here is coming to an end
4/22/2013 10:11 AM (edited)
Recently in Rupp I had a FR player become ineligible because he received a 1.9 GPA in his final term. In his first 2 terms with 5 mins of SH this player got GPAs of 2.7 and 3.4 so I decided to bump down his SH in an attempt to get his ratings to improve faster as this guy has the ability to be a 200+ growth and 900 player by the time his career is over. In the third term his GPA dropped to 2.1 so I figured that if I simply move the SH back to 5 mins like it had been the previous 2 terms that at the very worst it would hold steady at 2.1 and figured more than likely it would go up to the 2.5-2.7 range. Then out comes the final term GPA and he wont be playing the rest of the season. So naturally I am not happy and decide to send a ticket to CS to figure out what the hell happened. The next exchange is what I have had with them starting with their response to my ticket: 

Customer Support
GPA is heavily influenced by study hall time, but there's no amount that is 100% guaranteed. 5 minutes of study hall is not a large amount. Many times that may be enough, but some players will need more. When you see something low like a 2.1, it's best to add study hall time to increase that player's odds of making the grade.

4/22/2013 9:33 AM slyman9
I have played this game for a very long time and I know how SH works. This response is an insult to me and how long I have been a paying customer to this website. A player should not have his GPA decrease from a 2.1 to a 1.9 after his SH mins get INCREASED back to the same level that had earned him a 2.7 & 3.4 earlier in the year.

Customer Support here has always been a huge joke and this just goes to reenforce that belief. I will not pay another penny to WIS and will not be returning once my seasons are over. This website has gone to **** since it got bought out and new management took over. To give someone who has been a loyal member of WIS since 2002 this response just shows how poorly management at this company is.

4/22/2013 9:38 AM Customer Support
There is a random factor involved in GPA. Study hall is a modifier of that random factor, so the more you have the better your odds. But, there is no guarantee. Otherwise there would be no strategy involved.

This feature of the game has always worked similarly. In fact a somewhat recent change was made to increase the impact of study hall on the GPA outcome.

5 minutes is not a large amount for a freshman. I believe most coaches allocate closer to 10 minutes.



4/22/2013 10:00 AM (edited)
So with that I would like to thank all of the coaches I have had interactions with over the years and have made HD so enjoyable. Guys like Trentonjoe, Jake_marley, tarvolon, brian_bowen, indianajoe, etdad, bhbum, johnsensing, metsmax, sir_slam and everyone else in my current conferences and other coaches like jdno & flyer, it has been fun and I have enjoyed the rivalries with y'all. People like Rails who helped me out when I first started HD and other like girt, billyg, aejones have all been helpful in helping me along the way at one point or another.
I have been a member here since 2002 when I was a 12 year old and was doing chores to pay for my next team and have definitely had a lot of competitive fun. Its sad that this is how my time here will end but I will not continue to pay for something that the loyal customers are treated with so little respect by those in management. 
So to everyone that I have ever been in a conference with or have had some of those long home-home series with I just want to say thank you and good luck with all of your future endeavors
4/22/2013 9:58 AM
First of all, you are leaving out a very important piece of information... what was his high school GPA?

Sorry, but CS is 100% right here. Why are you upset because you made, with all due respect, an extremely risky move (not knowing HS GPA admittedly)? If you don't want to play anymore because you're upset, that's fine, but the mistake was all yours and I think any mentor could have told you that in advance. This one is purely on the coach.
4/22/2013 9:59 AM
In the third term his GPA dropped to 2.1 so I figured that if I simply move the SH back to 5 mins like it had been the previous 2 terms that at the very worst it would hold steady at 2.1 and figured more than likely it would go up to the 2.5-2.7 range.

No offense, but this was a mistake.

If I had any guy I valued at all hit 2.1, I'd be giving him a MINIMUM of 10 minutes in study hall, and maybe even 15-20 just to make sure he'd stay eligible.
A player should not have his GPA decrease from a 2.1 to a 1.9 after his SH mins get INCREASED back to the same level that had earned him a 2.7 & 3.4 earlier in the year.

I (kind of) disagree with this statement. The player could be slacking off and not studying much, and once that happens, it makes sense he'd need MORE help to get back to his former level.
5 minutes is not a large amount for a freshman. I believe most coaches allocate closer to 10 minutes.

I always allocate 10 minutes to study hall for freshman until I think they are solidly in the range of 3.0 or better (that way there is little chance they will drop so sharply). If they are in that range I'll decrease to 5 minutes of study hall and see if they stay there. If they do I drop to 0 for study hall, if not its back to 10.
4/22/2013 10:04 AM
Honestly, I've had freshman in jeapardy of becoming ineligible with well over 5 allocated SH minutes (7 or 8 mins). I think 5 or less minutes is really reserved for upperclassmen, seniors in particular. Even though you had decent results from 5 mins. early on, I'm not shocked that a FR would become ineligible with 5 or less minutes of SH. I think you pushed it with 5 minutes and suffered in the end. I will say that I have never seen a FR get that high of a GPA with only 5 minutes of SH so maybe that is the real issue here. That's a misleading GPA variation. Hope you keep playing.
4/22/2013 10:14 AM (edited)
bistiza- I have played 125 seasons on this account alone and every player I start at 5 mins of SH during their FR year and if they are at the 3.0 range I usually bump them down to 3 and if they are struggling like two other players on that same team, then they will be up in the 8-10 range and possibly more. I have NEVER had this happen to ANY players in those 125 seasons so I must be doing something right in terms of my strategy. The player was sitting at 2.1 for his 3rd term so its not like he was in the ineligible range at that point in time so moving him back from 3 min SH to 5 mins SH is almost doubling it and I thought would have at the VERY WORST held him steady at 2.1

4/22/2013 10:19 AM
So because you have always been lucky you should never get unlucky?
4/22/2013 10:20 AM
3 min of SH to 5 min is not enough. I would have bumped him to 15min of SH to be sure that he won't fail. Imo, this is on you. You decided to gamble and lost.
4/22/2013 10:29 AM
The player was sitting at 2.1 for his 3rd term so its not like he was in the ineligible range at that point in time so moving him back from 3 min SH to 5 mins SH is almost doubling it and I thought would have at the VERY WORST held him steady at 2.1

I wouldn't even take the risk with a guy at 2.1. If he was MAYBE at 2.5, I'd risk only having him on 5 minutes of study hall as a freshman. Anything below 2.5 and there's no way he'd get less than ten.

The reason: Exactly what happened here with you - I don't want to risk that.

Not to be too harsh because anyone can make a mistake, but I agree with most others in the assessment this is exactly what happened here - you made a mistake.

You tried to walk a fine line and maximize the amount of minutes for practice so absolutely nothing would be wasted on study hall - and that's a great thing if you can do it, but it's not without its risks.

Sure, you've either gotten lucky or managed to make the perfect adjustments in terms of study hall minutes in the past, but it didn't work out this time. You say you've played over 125 seasons and this is the first time this has happened - that means you've been over 99 percent successful based on seasons alone (and not counting mid terms and two grading periods each season).

I'd say you shouldn't blame WIS or customer service for you walking a fine line, taking a risk, and it coming back to bite you one time in 125 seasons.
4/22/2013 10:39 AM (edited)
Posted by arssanguinus on 4/22/2013 10:19:00 AM (view original):
So because you have always been lucky you should never get unlucky?
No I figured a 125+ season sample size doing the same thing would be enough to understand HD well enough to know what I am doing but I suppose I should have never assumed that I had an understanding of HD
4/22/2013 10:38 AM
Posted by bistiza on 4/22/2013 10:29:00 AM (view original):
The player was sitting at 2.1 for his 3rd term so its not like he was in the ineligible range at that point in time so moving him back from 3 min SH to 5 mins SH is almost doubling it and I thought would have at the VERY WORST held him steady at 2.1

I wouldn't even take the risk with a guy at 2.1. If he was MAYBE at 2.5, I'd risk only having him on 5 minutes of study hall as a freshman. Anything below 2.5 and there's no way he'd get less than ten.

The reason: Exactly what happened here with you - I don't want to risk that.

Not to be too harsh because anyone can make a mistake, but I agree with most others in the assessment this is exactly what happened here - you made a mistake.

You tried to walk a fine line and maximize the amount of minutes for practice so absolutely nothing would be wasted on study hall - and that's a great thing if you can do it, but it's not without its risks.

Sure, you've either gotten lucky or managed to make the perfect adjustments in terms of study hall minutes in the past, but it didn't work out this time. You say you've played over 125 seasons and this is the first time this has happened - that means you've been over 99 percent successful based on seasons alone (and not counting mid terms and two grading periods each season).

I'd say you shouldn't blame WIS or customer service for you walking a fine line, taking a risk, and it coming back to bite you one time in 125 seasons.
Im not blaming customer service for my player being ineligible bc that is on me at the end of the day but the response was far from adequate for someone who has paid as much money as I have over the last 11 years on this website. 
4/22/2013 10:43 AM (edited)
So them telling the truth was inadequate? What else were they supposed to do?
4/22/2013 10:43 AM
First, I want to say that I'm not complaining.

Second, I'd like to say that I also get ****** when this kind of thing happens to me, but I take it in stride and I KNOW that others will never see it from my point of view, simply because most people allocate a TON more study hall time than I do.

Slyman9, I agree with your strategy because I use it myself. I think you are mad, and also I think you're over-reacting a little, but I also think this is because you have thus far been extremely lucky. Not lucky in the sense that you're strategy is wrong, per say, but more lucky in the sense that you haven't had a few more examples of this in your HD career. I don't have those issues frequently, but I do get them on a semi regular basis. Most of that is corrected before it gets to the ineligible point. I'd have many more ineligibles if I had not already been down this road myself several times. As soon as I see the crap midterm report, I know from my experiences past that I'll have to jack up his SH time considerably.

Most players do well with 5-7 mins added to the 3-5 (depending on HS GPA) that they start with, but some take this to the extreme and need 15 or more. I've recently had 2 blockheads who failed 2 semesters when each had over 20 mins of study hall. Those guys are rare, but they are out there. Also, for those of you thinking it, no, they did not come back on the scout reports as terrible in the classroom. Both of them were average. Had they come back as mediocre or below average, I'd have started them a little higher to begin with. They also had GPA of 2.5 or more. I feel that what happened was the random factor, combined with my preference for lower SH time. I don't like it, but I know the consequences. I don't like it, but I also can't claim surprise, no matter how much it boggles my mind that any idiot can fail with 15-20 plus Mins of SH time. Sometimes, I guess the guy is just a blockhead for whatever reason.

Also, to head off the flaming:  I don't take scholarship lightly in real life, but this is a game, the players are not real and I don't care if they stay at 2.0 for their entire career, as long as they can play the game, I'm good with that. This is a feature built in to give it the feel of reality, but I don't have to drink the Kool-aid on this particular issue to be happy.

4/22/2013 10:48 AM

This thread is hysterical and I never get the point. Usually goes like this. User does something the general HD community thinks is wrong. Writes CS, doesnt like their response...decides to quit. User decides rather then just quit, he must make some public announcement declaring why he quit trying to rally support except everyone tells him he is wrong. User fights back claiming he is right pointing towards 100+ seasons of experience, ignoring that he is being told he is wrong by a collective which consists of 5000+ seasons of experience. User doesnt quit.

4/22/2013 10:48 AM
No I figured a 125+ season sample size doing the same thing would be enough to understand HD well enough to know what I am doing but I suppose I should have never assumed that I had an understanding of HD

As I already said, from what you're saying, you've been walking on the edge of the cliff with this issue for a long time. Frankly I'm surprised this hasn't happened sooner.

Instead of assuming you had this wonderful understanding of the game, maybe you should have just put a few more minutes into study hall time to make sure your players are never at 2.1 to begin with - my guys are usually never much below 3.0, and I've never had a guy at 2.1.
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