7/1/2013 11:51 AM
Posted by burnsy483 on 7/1/2013 11:31:00 AM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2013 11:21:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/1/2013 10:24:00 AM (view original):
If it makes you feel better, I think each individual marriage, traditional or same sex, is different.   I don't necessarily think married parents are any better at child-rearing than unmarried parents. 
Parenting is more a function of the people involved.  Having them being married provides a marginal benefit in that it provides a level of stability and security to the family unit.
I'm assuming you would also mean a civil union works with this argument too, yes? As in there's no difference.
No, because as I've stated numerous times, children are better served with oppisite sex parents.
7/1/2013 11:52 AM
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2013 11:51:00 AM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 7/1/2013 11:31:00 AM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2013 11:21:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/1/2013 10:24:00 AM (view original):
If it makes you feel better, I think each individual marriage, traditional or same sex, is different.   I don't necessarily think married parents are any better at child-rearing than unmarried parents. 
Parenting is more a function of the people involved.  Having them being married provides a marginal benefit in that it provides a level of stability and security to the family unit.
I'm assuming you would also mean a civil union works with this argument too, yes? As in there's no difference.
No, because as I've stated numerous times, children are better served with oppisite sex parents.
Sorry, I'll word better.  

"Having them being married provides a marginal benefit in that it provides a level of stability and security to the family unit."

If we're talking about homosexuals, does being in a civil union provide the same level of stability as a marriage would? In your opinion.

7/1/2013 11:53 AM
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2013 11:50:00 AM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2013 11:29:00 AM (view original):
1) You are free to believe that. Other people disagree. Beliefs are personal, though, and you shouldn't try to impose yours on others. No one is requiring that you live your life a certain way, extend others the same courtesy.

2) see #1

3) the choice isn't opposite sex parents or gay parents, it's gay married parents or gay unmarried parents. It's pretty clear that children benefit when their parents are married.
How is expressing my beliefs the same as imposing them on others?

Isn't that EXACTLY the same as what you've been doing this entire thread?

Should I chide you for trying to imposing your beliefs on me?
Expressing your beliefs is fine. I know that you would never enter into a gay marriage. That's ok. My problem is when you say others shouldn't be allowed to.

7/1/2013 12:00 PM
Posted by burnsy483 on 7/1/2013 11:31:00 AM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2013 11:21:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/1/2013 10:24:00 AM (view original):
If it makes you feel better, I think each individual marriage, traditional or same sex, is different.   I don't necessarily think married parents are any better at child-rearing than unmarried parents. 
Parenting is more a function of the people involved.  Having them being married provides a marginal benefit in that it provides a level of stability and security to the family unit.
I'm assuming you would also mean a civil union works with this argument too, yes? As in there's no difference.
I think tec is saying that a civil union and marriage are the same thing.

Right, tec?
7/1/2013 12:06 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2013 12:00:00 PM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 7/1/2013 11:31:00 AM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2013 11:21:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/1/2013 10:24:00 AM (view original):
If it makes you feel better, I think each individual marriage, traditional or same sex, is different.   I don't necessarily think married parents are any better at child-rearing than unmarried parents. 
Parenting is more a function of the people involved.  Having them being married provides a marginal benefit in that it provides a level of stability and security to the family unit.
I'm assuming you would also mean a civil union works with this argument too, yes? As in there's no difference.
I think tec is saying that a civil union and marriage are the same thing.

Right, tec?
One (marriage) has been around  for tens of thousands of years, and has a very specific and traditional connotation.

The other (civil union) has only been around a few decades, and has a slightly different meaning.
7/1/2013 12:33 PM
Posted by burnsy483 on 7/1/2013 11:52:00 AM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2013 11:51:00 AM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 7/1/2013 11:31:00 AM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2013 11:21:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/1/2013 10:24:00 AM (view original):
If it makes you feel better, I think each individual marriage, traditional or same sex, is different.   I don't necessarily think married parents are any better at child-rearing than unmarried parents. 
Parenting is more a function of the people involved.  Having them being married provides a marginal benefit in that it provides a level of stability and security to the family unit.
I'm assuming you would also mean a civil union works with this argument too, yes? As in there's no difference.
No, because as I've stated numerous times, children are better served with oppisite sex parents.
Sorry, I'll word better.  

"Having them being married provides a marginal benefit in that it provides a level of stability and security to the family unit."

If we're talking about homosexuals, does being in a civil union provide the same level of stability as a marriage would? In your opinion.

You missed this.
7/1/2013 12:37 PM
Sure, I suppose so.
7/1/2013 12:40 PM
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2013 12:37:00 PM (view original):
Sure, I suppose so.
OK.  No further point on this then.
7/1/2013 12:41 PM
Posted by burnsy483 on 7/1/2013 11:06:00 AM (view original):
The crux of the argument - there are some, like BL and myself, who really don't see a difference on how gays have a relationship, raise children, live their lives in general (aside from their sexuality). They're people, like anyone.  There are others, like Mike and tec, who think that the way gays live is so different than heterosexuals that they have to be treated differently.  
So different that they have to be treated differently?

I think individuals are different.  Couples are different.    The traditional family unit, the one that's been around forever, consists of a mom and a dad.   To the point I made earlier, children are not kind.   Being "different" may be fine and dandy when you're older but it's not something to strive for when you're a child.   My two dads is different.  I don't know that it's such a great idea.   It may be fantastic or it may be a ******* childhood nightmare.    I just don't think we know enough to be passing out children to every gay couple because they want one.   And I think adoption services are probably afraid to decline a gay couple's request because of discrimination charges.

7/1/2013 12:43 PM
Posted by burnsy483 on 7/1/2013 11:48:00 AM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2013 11:35:00 AM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 7/1/2013 11:28:00 AM (view original):
I mean, you don't consider 2 fathers and their child a family, so obviously you think they're doing something significantly different.

Maybe the "way gays live" was the wrong wording for you, but I think you're missing the point and maybe being dense on purpose.  You see a significant enough difference between homosexuals and heterosexuals when it comes to being couples and raising children to treat them differently.  I don't.
(sigh)

To me, a family is a mother, a father, and children.  What's missing in your example above is mom.  That, and you have an extra dad.

I'm fine with homosexual couples.  Just don't call their formal union "marriage", because marriage is between a man and a woman.

As far as raising children, in a case of adoption, I believe that adopted children are better served in a traditional family with a mom and a dad, because I believe men and woman each bring something different to the parenting experience and providing for a better rounded experience for the child growing up.

What parts of the above three things are you not understanding.
Nothing.  I think you just agreed with my statement.  (or maybe I am misunderstanding something)
I would ABSOLUTELY consider two fathers and a child a family.  I disagree with the premise that just because there's 2 of the same sex raising a child, that it would be much different.  You do, and that's the crux of the argument.  A homosexual relationship is significantly different than a heterosexual relationship, in your opinion.  In my opinion, it's not.  And here we are.  That's all I'm saying.
7/1/2013 12:47 PM
You're also an adult(at least in age).   Ask a 6 year old.   You know, the people they'll be hanging around with all day.
7/1/2013 12:49 PM
So we have different opinions.

Why are we still talking about this?
7/1/2013 1:05 PM
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2013 12:06:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2013 12:00:00 PM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 7/1/2013 11:31:00 AM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2013 11:21:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/1/2013 10:24:00 AM (view original):
If it makes you feel better, I think each individual marriage, traditional or same sex, is different.   I don't necessarily think married parents are any better at child-rearing than unmarried parents. 
Parenting is more a function of the people involved.  Having them being married provides a marginal benefit in that it provides a level of stability and security to the family unit.
I'm assuming you would also mean a civil union works with this argument too, yes? As in there's no difference.
I think tec is saying that a civil union and marriage are the same thing.

Right, tec?
One (marriage) has been around  for tens of thousands of years, and has a very specific and traditional connotation.

The other (civil union) has only been around a few decades, and has a slightly different meaning.
In terms of child rearing, they are the same?
7/1/2013 1:10 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/1/2013 12:47:00 PM (view original):
You're also an adult(at least in age).   Ask a 6 year old.   You know, the people they'll be hanging around with all day.
Maybe someone should do a study of 500 kids of gay parents and see how they turned out?
7/1/2013 1:11 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2013 1:10:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/1/2013 12:47:00 PM (view original):
You're also an adult(at least in age).   Ask a 6 year old.   You know, the people they'll be hanging around with all day.
Maybe someone should do a study of 500 kids of gay parents and see how they turned out?

As I said, 500 isn't a whole lot.  

As I said, I don't even think those 500 were in our society.

Your point?

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