All Forums > SimLeague Football > NFL > How good is this year's group of rookie QB's
12/21/2012 9:41 AM
When all is said and done, barring any major injuries, where will this years rookie class of QB's rank all time

Andrew Luck, Robert Griffin III, Russel Wilson, Ryan Tannehill, Brandon Weedon, Nick Foles, Ryan Lindley, Kirk Cousins

Some other QB classes

2011 - Cam Newton, Andy Dalton, Colin Kaepernick, Christian Ponder, Blaine Gabbert, Jake Locker, TJ Yates

2004 - Eli Manning, Ben Roethlisberger, Philip Rivers, Matt Schaub, JP Losman


and of course the class all future classes are measured against

1983 - John Elway, Dan Marino, Jim Kelly, Ken O'Brien, Tony Eason, Todd Blackledge


Just as an aside, this years rookie RB's are off to a great start as well with Alfred Morris, Trent Richardson, Doug Martin, Vick Ballard, Bryce Brown, and Darryl Richardson (even Turbin, Pearce, and Hillman have looked alright in more limited action).
12/21/2012 2:52 PM
Luck and Griffin have staying power.   Griffin's career may fall to the wayside due to injury(as a big part of his game is running).   Wilson and Tennehill might stick around awhile but, quite honestly, Wilson is going to fight "too short" his entire career.   Brees was run out of SD for a more "conventional" QB in size.    The rest are non-issues with the exception of Cousins if Griffin gets hurt or Cousins moves on.

I think we'll look back at the 2011 class and say "meh".   It's possible Kaepernick will be the best.

Mentioning Losman is funny.   Rivers went from sugar to **** overnight it seems.   The other three have limitations and they've shown them.

However, if you compare them to what is considered the "greatest" class ever, it looks like any class that has three outstanding QB could be ranked up there with them.  Unless someone steps up with Griffin/Luck, 1983 will continue to reign supreme.
12/21/2012 3:56 PM
2004 does have more Superbowl wins than 1983 already.  If they can get a couple of more Superbowl appearances (especially if they pick up another win or two) then they will get pretty close in total # of appearances and thus I think you could make a real argument.  I mean as great as 83 was the QB's won just 2 Superbowls (both by Elway).  Obviously Elway is 5 Superbowls, Kelly in 4, and Marino in the 1 for 10 total.  04 is at just 5 total, but 4 are wins (eli 2-0, ben 2-1).  Also, Eli and Ben will pass Kelly's total yards in the next season or so and if they get another 6 or so seasons will both pass Elway as well (marino is way out there, but the Manning's have great genes, so Eli would have a shot to get to him).  Rivers isn't that far behind Kelly either (2 good seasons away) and Schaub is gaining ground rapidly (about 3.5 good seasons away from Kelly).  It doesn't look like Houston, Pittsburgh, or New York are going to be bad teams any time soon and some new coaching and GMing in San Diego might revive that franchise as well.  Certainly possible that 4-some eclipses 83.  And for the record, I put Losman in there because he exceeded 5,000 career yards (also why Blackledge is in there).  Eason was only at about 11,000 career yards as well.  83 was really the 3 HOFers and O'Brien with a solid career. 

I think you are underselling Wilson a lot.  He looks pretty damn good as a rookie and has Seattle poised to make a deep playoff run already.  Weedon is going to start in Cleveland for at least another year, and he has gotten better.  Granted he is old, but I could easily see him as a 7-8 year starter, which if he is the 4th or 5th best guy from the class would be a very strong QB from that position.
12/21/2012 4:09 PM

I don't think I'd compare yardage totals from 1983 to modern day.    Different game.

As far as Super Bowls wins or appearances, BR was nothing more than a "game manager" his first few seasons and won a Super Bowl.   EM has always been perplexing to me.   He just has those games where he appears to have just walked off a HS field and then looks like the best Manning QB ever the next game.  As much as I hate Elway, I used to play NFL Blitz with Denver, run bootlegs until Elway was carted off, laugh and then turn off the game, I can't put BR or EM in his class as a QB.   I could probably be convinced that EM/BR should be mentioned with Marino and Kelly.  Rivers, Schaub and Losman aren't the caliber of those guys.

I know how Wilson has looked.  I also know what the NFL "braintrust" thought of him.  So much that he played an extra season in college when he could have gone pro.   So much that he fell to the third round.    He has the "feel" of a QB who'll have to earn his job every year.  The first really bad stretch of games he has will be followed with "Yeah, he's just too short to be a consistent QB" comments.

12/21/2012 4:36 PM
Maybe you can't compare yards, but Jim Kelly only finished in the top ten in yards in a season 6 times and only three of those were top 5 and never finished better than 3rd.  Eli and Rivers both have 5 top ten's already and Rivers led the league one year.  Obviously marino and elways are different animals, but they aren't that much further along than eli and phil in that category at the same experience factor.  Ben has been coming on lately in it as well.  Heck even Schaub led the league one year and has another top 5 finish.  In other words, these guys are consistently as good or better than Kelly, are fairly similar to Elway, and not all that far off of Marino when compared to the league for yards.
12/21/2012 5:12 PM
I'm not a big Jim Kelly fan, he's a bit of a jerk, so I really don't want to defend him.    He played in BUFFALO wih THURMAN THOMAS who is in the HALL OF FAME.   It's 12 degrees with snow and 25 MPH winds.   Throw the ball or hand it to a HOF RB?   Doesn't seem like there is an option.

Rivers had Tomlinson.
EM and BR have/had a collection of crap.

Meh on top 5/10 passing yards.
12/23/2012 11:54 AM
Passing yards isn't a good way to compare QB.  Vinny Testaverde, Drew Bledsoe, Kerry Collins, Dave Krieg and Boomer Esiason aren't getting into the HOF (and those guys have 35,000+ passing yards).  SB wins/appearances , TD, pro bowls are a better indicator of QB greatness IMO.
12/23/2012 12:54 PM
Trent Dilfer has a SB win. 
Vince Young went to the Pro Bowl.

Honestly, it's a combination of the entire job of QB.   A QB has to be able to throw the ball when he has to throw the ball, check to a run when it's necessary, not commit the turnover when it's unnecessary and squeeze the ball in a tiny window when it is necessary.   All those things will lead to yards, TDs, Super Bowl and Pro Bowls.

I've spend a good bit of time mocking Peyton's arm strength, because it's weak as hell, but he's still a damn good QB because he can still do all the things listed above.
12/23/2012 3:17 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 12/23/2012 12:54:00 PM (view original):
Trent Dilfer has a SB win. 
Vince Young went to the Pro Bowl.

Honestly, it's a combination of the entire job of QB.   A QB has to be able to throw the ball when he has to throw the ball, check to a run when it's necessary, not commit the turnover when it's unnecessary and squeeze the ball in a tiny window when it is necessary.   All those things will lead to yards, TDs, Super Bowl and Pro Bowls.

I've spend a good bit of time mocking Peyton's arm strength, because it's weak as hell, but he's still a damn good QB because he can still do all the things listed above.
One SB win and one PB (Dilfer) or two PBs (Young) doesn't mean ur great.  I agree with ur premise that if a QB makes good decisions he will be successful, I don't think many people will dispute that.
12/23/2012 3:37 PM
With regards to this years draft class, I think Luck will have the best career, but RG3 and Wilson can have a lot of success if they stay healthy.  I think with Wilson's success this year (and the success of Brees) he won't have to fight for a starting job every year, even though he doesn't have prototypical height for a QB.  The 1983 class vs the 2004 class is Elway, Marino, Kelly vs Manning, Roethlisberger, Rivers, Schaub (the others don't really matter).  Elway is the best of all those QB and right now I'd still give the edge to the 1983 class, but the 2004 class still has several years to pad their resumes.
12/23/2012 10:43 PM
Russell Wilson, as a 3rd round pick has really developed into a leader....Very few interceptions...he is a winner.
12/31/2012 1:12 AM
Bigger question, how crappy do the Chiefs feel this year? They just watched last year's draft class, they have the top pick, they need a QB - and the draft could be relatively thin at the position.
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