6/20/2012 2:02 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/20/2012 2:00:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/20/2012 12:46:00 PM (view original):
What kind of dumbshit question is that?   You asked if Clemens "knew" he didn't take steroids, I responded that I think he "believes" he didn't.   And your response is "So what?"  

WTF is wrong with you?   Any further response in this thread before that question is answered will be redlined.   I just don't have any desire for your bullshit today.
This.
This what?  You aren't asking a question.

And I'm really not either.

I'm pointing out how stupid that answer is.  Clemens didn't know he took steroids because he deluded himself into believing the steroids weren't working.
6/20/2012 2:03 PM
And you can keep redlining, that's fine.  The redlines will be gone in a day or two.
6/20/2012 2:07 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/20/2012 11:30:00 AM (view original):
One recanted his statement.  The other isn't even the least bit credible.

If I said "I saw burnsy rape a 12 year old", does that mean you should always have that tag around your neck?
Jason Grimsey also implicated Clemens.
6/20/2012 2:09 PM
Posted by jrd_x on 6/20/2012 12:39:00 PM (view original):
So what?  I strongly believe that steroids are not a magic bullet and that their effects are vastly overstated, but Clemens' delusion isn't an excuse.  
Maybe steroids, but HGH is the magic bullet.
6/20/2012 2:11 PM
Posted by The Taint on 6/20/2012 2:09:00 PM (view original):
Posted by jrd_x on 6/20/2012 12:39:00 PM (view original):
So what?  I strongly believe that steroids are not a magic bullet and that their effects are vastly overstated, but Clemens' delusion isn't an excuse.  
Maybe steroids, but HGH is the magic bullet.
Is it?  The only studies I saw suggested it didn't do much, but that was a couple years ago (and the participants in the study were seniors).  Maybe something new has been discovered.
6/20/2012 2:12 PM
I don't think so.   The NYT said he did but the Mitchell Report states his connections with McNamee and the NYT jumped to Pettite and Clemens from there.
6/20/2012 2:13 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/20/2012 12:35:00 PM (view original):
I mentioned a theory a few years ago after reading "The Rocket that fell to earth".

I think he was working hard, just like always, and not getting the same results.
He tried something that allowed him to work harder(which is really all 'roids do).
After awhile, he began to believe that the lack of previous results was a mental issue.   That maybe he wasn't pushing himself hard enough.
Over time, he believes that what he took was nothing more than a placebo, or a B-12 shot, and that the results were simply him busting his ***.

Just another version of repeating the same lie so many times that you begin to believe it's the truth.    So I believe he believes that he took nothing that helped him physically.  He just needed the mental boost. 
I guess if I said something this stupid ^, I'd want to redline responses too.

Me: Clemens didn't know he took steroids?
Mike: He took them, but then deluded himself into believing they were a placebo
Me: ???
6/20/2012 2:15 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/20/2012 2:12:00 PM (view original):
I don't think so.   The NYT said he did but the Mitchell Report states his connections with McNamee and the NYT jumped to Pettite and Clemens from there.
Are you arguing that Clemens is clean?

I think that's a stretch, even with the acquittal.


6/20/2012 2:16 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/20/2012 2:00:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/20/2012 12:46:00 PM (view original):
What kind of dumbshit question is that?   You asked if Clemens "knew" he didn't take steroids, I responded that I think he "believes" he didn't.   And your response is "So what?"  

WTF is wrong with you?   Any further response in this thread before that question is answered will be redlined.   I just don't have any desire for your bullshit today.
This.
You do know that I'm going to continue to respond and when sitestaff lifts the redlines you are going to look like a coward.
6/20/2012 2:16 PM
The question you need to answer, since you've forgotten, is "WTF is wrong with you?"   Why must you nitpick wording to turn everything into an argument.   As I said, I don't have the desire for that bullshit in this thread.     Now, if you'd like to answer, you can participate in this thread.   If not, it's two button clicks for me.
6/20/2012 2:18 PM
Clemens should be in the Hall of Fame.
6/20/2012 2:20 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/20/2012 2:16:00 PM (view original):
The question you need to answer, since you've forgotten, is "WTF is wrong with you?"   Why must you nitpick wording to turn everything into an argument.   As I said, I don't have the desire for that bullshit in this thread.     Now, if you'd like to answer, you can participate in this thread.   If not, it's two button clicks for me.
I'm not nitpicking anything.

You suggested that Clemens didn't know he took steroids.  When asked for clarification you responded with a BS story about him deluding himself into believing they were a placebo.  Even if he really did believe they were a placebo, he still knew he took steroids. 
6/20/2012 3:34 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/20/2012 1:49:00 PM (view original):
You're missing the point.  You refused to pay me some money after a long business relationship.   I've seen you in the company of 12 year olds and, well, that just seems odd to me, MichaelJackson483.   I'm a little ****** so I say you raped a 12 y/o.   You mentioned your friendship with a 12 year old to a friend, MichaelJackson483.    He kind of remembers something, maybe you raped a 12 y/o, maybe you showed them your peepee, he's not real sure but sure enough to not want to cover up something if you did it. 

As for what Clemens did or didn't do, or what he believes, I go back to repeating a story long enough to believe it's true.   There's enough truth in it to convince yourself that it's exactly what happened.   I'm sure that Clemens didn't buy 'roids.   His trainer did.    If McNamee didn't tell him exactly what he was injecting, if he injected anything other than B12, there's no reason for Clemens to believe it was 'roids unless he wanted to believe.  Quite honestly, and I'm sure we're all guilty of it in some way, not knowing everything gives us plausible deniability.
Has Clemens given a reason for B-Mac to be angry with him? Maybe he has and I missed it.  Had he said something like "He thinks I owe him money, now he's making up ****," I would get that.

I understand if he got to the point where his routine seemed like second nature, he didn't think he was doing anything wrong, he just kept working hard and he kept pitching well.  And I get if he thinks this whole thing is unfair, because I'm sure he did work harder than most.  But again, if the question is "did he take steroids" then, yes, he did.
6/20/2012 4:38 PM
Probably.  As has been noted, Clemens is a bit of a *****.   I've heard rumors of McNamee having a sick or disabled kid and Clemens refusing to help him with some medical bills.  Clemens obviously fired him at some point.  McNamee was questioned about 'roids and I have no doubt that he was told he had to give up a big name to escape jail time.    At the end of the day, McNamee has a lot of demons and every bit of him screams "weasel".   After all, why even mention Clemens?  If the feds had something, they don't need McNamee.

If Clemens said "Brian, I need something to get me going" that doesn't mean he knew what it was.   He may not have asked because he may not have wanted to know.  Therefore, to him, he took B12 shots.
6/20/2012 4:45 PM
I always find it interesting that a professional athlete wouldn't know exactly what it is he is taking.  Maybe, to maintain plausible deniability, it's done with a wink and a nod, but he knows what he is taking.

But even with the steroids Clemens should be a lock for the hall.
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