Posted by mchales_army on 5/13/2015 5:23:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 4:48:00 PM (view original):

Posted by mchales_army on 5/13/2015 4:34:00 PM (view original):
Mark my words, if the supreme court comes down with a decision in favor of gay marriage and forcing it on all of the states, in very quick order you will see what the agenda really is all about.

They will systematically go after Christian owned businesses, and file law suit after law suit.

If someone says "I will not serve your kind, get out of my store" THAT is discrimination.
If someone says "I will gladly sell you anything we have in the store on any day, thanks for coming in, but if you ask me to make you a wedding cake for your gay wedding, I will have to decline." That is NOT discrimination, yet that will be the basis of 100s of law suits by the end of the year.

The two circumstances are very different but they will try to convince the courts that they are not different in any way.

What does and does not constitute discrimination by businesses against gays is not on trial. (But I am curious, if a business owner told a Christian couple that they wouldn't bake a cake for their wedding because they don't agree with Christianity, would you think that is OK?)

The question the court's facing is whether or not the government has the right to tell gays they aren't allowed to marry. That's a much easier question to answer.

Not now it isn't.
But it will be very quickly after the supreme court rules to nullify the will of the people of a large number of states.

Posted by mchales_army on 5/13/2015 5:27:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 5:19:00 PM (view original):
And what, exactly, is the gay agenda?

The majority of the LGBT people would be satisfied being granted what they see as equal rights.

However there is a militant faction of this movement whose ultimate agenda is to silence any who would disagree with their lifestyle. 

These are the ones behind the Stutzman case, behind the push to remove Brendan Eich as CEO from Mozilla, etc.

They want to PUNISH anyone who dares not celebrate their lifestyle.

What I said was when the supreme court rules in favor of legalizing gay marriage, then you will see a flurry of well targeted law suits against Christian owned businesses for refusing to celebrate the lifestyle.

Just like when the whole Indiana fiasco was going on. I said this Governor is waffling, and as soon as he backs down even a little, the gaystapo are going to start saying how if they are amending the law it must be a bad law to begin with, and that is EXACTLY the argument they used when he opted to "add language to ensure, blah, blah, blah."

It was NEVER about discrimination it was and always has been about making sure that govt. can't over reach. The Hobby Lobby case was won on the very fact that the state they are head-quartered in had a RFRA law on the books. Many other states thought, "if they had been headquartered here they probably lose that case. Let's remedy that". 

But that isn't how it is painted in the media at all.

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 5:27:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 5/13/2015 5:21:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 5:13:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 5/13/2015 5:07:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 5:02:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 5/13/2015 5:00:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 4:53:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 5/13/2015 4:52:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 4:49:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 5/13/2015 4:48:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 3:52:00 PM (view original):
Ok, I can back down on that. War is what I want to avoid. If you think having a bunch of dudes hanging out at a military base but not actively fighting anyone is a good idea, fine.

To clarify:

Nobody wants Americans at war in the Middle East, or anywhere else for that matter, other than the people who stand to profit from the war machine.

But it's utterly foolish to take military action, or at least the threat of military action, off the table as an option when it comes to protecting America's interests or national security.

Many on the left seem to not understand this.  They seem to think that vigorous finger wagging and stern words should be more than sufficient to handle any such situation.

No one is taking it off of the table. If there is a legitimate reason to go to war, fine. But, right now, there isn't one.

Is anybody here saying we should be going to war in the Middle East?

If you aren't, I guess no one is. Good job, we agree.

Wow.  Did you think I was arguing in favor of a war?

You're incredibly dumb.

You have argued for it recently, mr. boots on the ground. My bad if you changed your mind.

Is "war" the only reasonable definition of "boots on the ground" in your world?

You're incredibly dumb if you think so.

In the context of the post/thread, when you said "boots on the ground," you meant war:

Quote post by tecwrg on 9/4/2014 12:42:00 PM:

Posted by bad_luck on 9/4/2014 12:24:00 PM (view original):
How would you suggest we kill the terrorists?

Boots on the ground.  We go in after them.

You're conveniently forgetting this.

I'm not forgetting your backtrack, just ignoring it.

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 5:27:00 PM (view original):

Posted by mchales_army on 5/13/2015 5:23:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 4:48:00 PM (view original):

Posted by mchales_army on 5/13/2015 4:34:00 PM (view original):
Mark my words, if the supreme court comes down with a decision in favor of gay marriage and forcing it on all of the states, in very quick order you will see what the agenda really is all about.

They will systematically go after Christian owned businesses, and file law suit after law suit.

If someone says "I will not serve your kind, get out of my store" THAT is discrimination.
If someone says "I will gladly sell you anything we have in the store on any day, thanks for coming in, but if you ask me to make you a wedding cake for your gay wedding, I will have to decline." That is NOT discrimination, yet that will be the basis of 100s of law suits by the end of the year.

The two circumstances are very different but they will try to convince the courts that they are not different in any way.

What does and does not constitute discrimination by businesses against gays is not on trial. (But I am curious, if a business owner told a Christian couple that they wouldn't bake a cake for their wedding because they don't agree with Christianity, would you think that is OK?)

The question the court's facing is whether or not the government has the right to tell gays they aren't allowed to marry. That's a much easier question to answer.

Not now it isn't.
But it will be very quickly after the supreme court rules to nullify the will of the people of a large number of states.

We live in a republic, not a democracy. The will of the people only matters to a point.

Posted by tecwrg on 5/13/2015 9:16:00 AM (view original):

Posted by seamar_116 on 5/13/2015 9:07:00 AM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 5/11/2015 2:24:00 PM (view original):
Yep.  US isolationism proved that it worked really well in the 1930's when Hitler came to power in Germany and started killing all the Jews and then a bunch of Eastern Europeans at the start of WW2.

Let's go back to that.

Good job.

That's right... screw George Washington and his farewell address...he didn't know what the **** he was talking about.

Because the state of the world in 2015 is pretty much unchanged from what it was in 1796?

Posted by moy23 on 5/13/2015 11:38:00 AM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 11:19:00 AM (view original):
Did Hitler/WW2 happen? Of course.

Did U.S. isolationism cause it? Doubtful.

Will the U.S. avoiding war in the mid-east cause another Hitler/WW2 scenario? No.

Interesting that the USA pulls out of Iraq and now Christians are getting eradicated in mass numbers.... Children are being kidnapped in large numbers to be sold, converted, or killed. Families are getting broken up by force. The movement has spread to Syria, Libya, Yeman, and is beginning to get a foothold in Pakistan, Jordan, and Egypt. Boko Haran and other terrorist organizations are rolling up to IS now as they become more organized.

To the contrary - the US is in Afghanistan and we do not hear any of the same sort of stories out of that country. Do you think if we pull out of Afghanistan that it would not turn into another Iraq where religious minorities are getting slaughtered in mass quantities?



I guess a good question for you is - "What do you think will happen in the middle east if America does nothing? What will the landscape look like in 5 years, 10 years? How great do you think ISIS reach will be?"

Posted by seamar_116 on 5/13/2015 6:17:00 PM (view original):

Posted by moy23 on 5/13/2015 11:38:00 AM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 11:19:00 AM (view original):
Did Hitler/WW2 happen? Of course.

Did U.S. isolationism cause it? Doubtful.

Will the U.S. avoiding war in the mid-east cause another Hitler/WW2 scenario? No.

Interesting that the USA pulls out of Iraq and now Christians are getting eradicated in mass numbers.... Children are being kidnapped in large numbers to be sold, converted, or killed. Families are getting broken up by force. The movement has spread to Syria, Libya, Yeman, and is beginning to get a foothold in Pakistan, Jordan, and Egypt. Boko Haran and other terrorist organizations are rolling up to IS now as they become more organized.

To the contrary - the US is in Afghanistan and we do not hear any of the same sort of stories out of that country. Do you think if we pull out of Afghanistan that it would not turn into another Iraq where religious minorities are getting slaughtered in mass quantities?



I guess a good question for you is - "What do you think will happen in the middle east if America does nothing? What will the landscape look like in 5 years, 10 years? How great do you think ISIS reach will be?"

Or, we could have left Saddam in power and saved hundreds of thousands of lives and this probably wouldn't have happened either.

Posted by bad_luck on 5/13/2015 4:48:00 PM (view original):

Posted by mchales_army on 5/13/2015 4:34:00 PM (view original):
Mark my words, if the supreme court comes down with a decision in favor of gay marriage and forcing it on all of the states, in very quick order you will see what the agenda really is all about.

They will systematically go after Christian owned businesses, and file law suit after law suit.

If someone says "I will not serve your kind, get out of my store" THAT is discrimination.
If someone says "I will gladly sell you anything we have in the store on any day, thanks for coming in, but if you ask me to make you a wedding cake for your gay wedding, I will have to decline." That is NOT discrimination, yet that will be the basis of 100s of law suits by the end of the year.

The two circumstances are very different but they will try to convince the courts that they are not different in any way.

What does and does not constitute discrimination by businesses against gays is not on trial. (But I am curious, if a business owner told a Christian couple that they wouldn't bake a cake for their wedding because they don't agree with Christianity, would you think that is OK?)

The question the court's facing is whether or not the government has the right to tell gays they aren't allowed to marry. That's a much easier question to answer.

That's a tough argument to make.  After all, they are refusing to make a cake simply because it's for a gay wedding.    Personally, I don't have a problem with a business having the right to refuse service to anyone, for whatever reason(I do it because some people act like dicks), but that sort of feels like discrimination. 

Posted by MikeT23 on 5/15/2015 8:21:00 AM (view original):

That's a tough argument to make.  After all, they are refusing to make a cake simply because it's for a gay wedding.    Personally, I don't have a problem with a business having the right to refuse service to anyone, for whatever reason(I do it because some people act like dicks), but that sort of feels like discrimination.